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England Team First SA Test
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 11:48

Brown still on wing, Robshaw retained, despite their defensive errors v Baa Baas. No place for Cipriani, Robson or Simmonds - even on bench.


England team to face South Africa: Elliot Daly; Jonny May, Henry Slade, Owen Farrell, Mike Brown; George Ford, Ben Youngs; Mako Vunipola, Jamie George, Kyle Sinckler, Maro Itoje, Nick Isiekwe, Chris Robshaw, Tom Curry, Billy Vunipola

Replacements: Luke Cowan-Dickie, Joe Marler, Harry Williams, Brad Shields, Nathan Hughes, Ben Spencer, Piers Francis, Denny Solomona

England more experienced than Sa overall - 500+ caps v 350, but SA have edge up front, especially front row.

PG

Re: England Team First SA Test
Posted by: BathBurger (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 11:51

The mind boggles. Great for Curry and Slade, tough on Lozowski and no idea what's going on with Brown.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/06/2018 11:54 by BathBurger.

Re: England Team First SA Test
Posted by: Rawce (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 11:57

Eddie trying his best to sap even more England enthusiasm from me. Can I be bothered to chuck 7 NowTVs way to watch it on Saturday? No.

Re: England Team First SA Test
Posted by: Barnetsarrie12 (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 12:04

I think he has picked Brown on the wing because he is good at the high ball if SA go that route and he probably will interchange with Daly maybe. SA have picked two fliers on the wing and if they come up against Brown one on one on the wing, it's not going to end well for us.

As for the other selections, I don't mind Slade starting, he has a chance now to show us what he can do but I don't understand for the life of me what Francis has done to get in the team ahead of Loz, I really don't get that one. I also would have gone Robson ahead of Spencer but my only guess is that Spencer is a better tactical kicker hence why he is on the bench.

I don't mind Robshaw starting game 1 as Shields is probably not yet fully up to speed as he only arrived in camp on Monday or Tuesday I think but, another poor game and shields takes that spot, rest of the team is fine to me and I hope Daly does well at FB.

Re: England Team First SA Test
Posted by: Big Dog (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 12:06

Brown on the wing is boggling... I can only presume he is being tasked with coming in and offering himself as an option short in the way Nowell does in the absence of anyone like that. Those wingers for SA are both electric quick though and we could be in real trouble there. Fortunately they don't have the same bulk as Tuisova like in the Baa Baa's game but their acceleration may be even better instead. Good luck to him...

Expect to see Robshaw come off 40/50 minutes in imo and see Shields replace him. That would be a much better looking back row even though I am still undecided on Shields.

Front row and second row very exciting starting lineup in terms of youth and power but am surprised to not see Launchbury in there at all! Lozowski also very unlucky to miss out but it would be even more Saracens lite with him in there. Francis lucky to make bench ahead of him for me.

Don't see and England win unfortunately this week if the Springboks throw the ball around a bit and stretch us.



Adopted players:
2018-19 Jonathan Joseph
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Re: England Team First SA Test
Posted by: nick holder (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 12:06

I think this is where it will finally unravel for EJ. He is an arrogant aussie Tw*t and the choice of Mike Brown anywhere near this side is mind boggling. I hope we get stuffed on this tour and he gets severely reprimanded for his stupidity in entering into a war of words with the clubs. At this point in the WC cycle we should be on an upward curve not a downward one. Compare our shambles to what is happening with the other home nations.

Re: England Team First SA Test
Posted by: Barnetsarrie12 (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 12:12

Totally disagree Nick, I don't like Eddie Jones and regardless of your feelings towards Jones, I don't get this idea of hoping we lose because you disagree with his selections. That is just such a weird mentality to me.

Whatever his battle of words with clubs is and it is a battle with Bruce Craig, not a battle with "clubs", that has nothing to do with anything and is secondary to the game on saturday that I hope we win regardless of my disagreement with some of his selections

Re: England Team First SA Test
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 12:25

[quote Big Dog]

Front row and second row very exciting starting lineup in terms of youth and power but am surprised to not see Launchbury in there at all!

Injured BD:

[www.bbc.co.uk]

I think it would be really bizarre, in the absence of Lawes and Kruis, if Eddie had left out a fit Launchbury altogether.

PG

Re: England Team First SA Test
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 12:28

Quote:
Barnetsarrie12
Totally disagree Nick, I don't like Eddie Jones and regardless of your feelings towards Jones, I don't get this idea of hoping we lose because you disagree with his selections. That is just such a weird mentality to me.
Whatever his battle of words with clubs is and it is a battle with Bruce Craig, not a battle with "clubs", that has nothing to do with anything and is secondary to the game on saturday that I hope we win regardless of my disagreement with some of his selections

The 6 Sarries in the starting team may have something to do with you having more enthusiasm for these games than us BS12. Real shame he hasn't tried out some of Danny Cipriani, Alex Lozowski, Jason Woodward and Mark Wilson but pleased that Tom Curry is there. Personally I will be clipping my nails or something at the weekend rather than bothering about the same old faces huffing and puffing their way around the pitch.

Re: England Team First SA Test
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 12:30

Brown's selection was almost inevitable given the squad selection. Earle is untried and Solomona's defence is suspect. But Brown going forward is a non starter, I can see him being severely embarrassed out there!

Re: England Team First SA Test
Posted by: Barnetsarrie12 (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 12:35

Haha Bath Matt trust me, I watched England when the team had no sarries players and will watch them when they have 23. It makes no difference to me and Sarries and England are 2 different teams and I take them and treat them as different entities.

I don't mind you saying you won't watch the game, no one can force you to watch, I had an issue with Nick saying he hoped we lost the game, to me that is not a great attitude to have because you don't like Eddie.

As much as I don't like Eddie and I don't as he is annoying most times, I want England to win always regardless of who is coach and those players have worked hard so, no way will I be hoping they go out there and "get stuffed"

Re: England Team First SA Test
Posted by: P G Tips (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 12:36

Barnetsarrie

Tony Roche of Exeter has given public support to Bruce. Mark McCafferty CEO PRL (&ex of your parish I believe) has also said PRL has a bone to pick with Eddie over training injuries, so I do not think it is a personal spat alone - though I accept Craig has been the most vociferous critic of training injuries to date.

PG

Re: England Team First SA Test
Posted by: Big Dog (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 12:36

Quote:
P G Tips
Injured BD:

[www.bbc.co.uk]

I think it would be really bizarre, in the absence of Lawes and Kruis, if Eddie had left out a fit Launchbury altogether.

PG

Thanks PG - I can always rely on you to have read up on these things where I haven't!!



Adopted players:
2018-19 Jonathan Joseph
2017-18 Shaun Knight

Re: England Team First SA Test
Posted by: Barnetsarrie12 (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 12:40

Quote:
P G Tips
Barnetsarrie
Tony Roche of Exeter has given public support to Bruce. Mark McCafferty CEO PRL (&ex of your parish I believe) has also said PRL has a bone to pick with Eddie over training injuries, so I do not think it is a personal spat alone - though I accept Craig has been the most vociferous critic of training injuries to date.

PG

You are right PG that those other guys have commented but the back and forth has been between Eddie and Bruce. I have not heard him mention Mark and Tony.

To me that is still insignificant, I don't care that Tony Rowe or whatever owner is fighting Eddie Jones, I want England to win, that has no effect on how i want England to perform.

Re: England Team First SA Test
Posted by: RuggyBuggy (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 13:02

I assume Brown and Daly will swap positions in defence at least, if not entirely. He must be planning on using Daly in the centre in attack, either as a strike runner or as an extra distributor. Having Brown defend on the wing is a recipe for disaster, at least Daly has pace to stay with the SA flyers. If problems at the ruck persist, SA will be very dangerous if they can move the ball wide off a turnover.

Not having a proper lock on the bench away to SA is madness. An injury to either starting lock (which is almost inevitable now) and that's the scrum and line out gone. Either lock could be moved to 6 if necessary so additional back row cover isn't required. Isiekwe will have to play out of his skin for the full 80, big ask.

Re: England Team First SA Test
Posted by: Omba (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 13:05

Robson held back for a Wasps half back combo next week?

Re: England Team First SA Test
Posted by: shipwrecked (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 13:10

Quote:
Barnetsarrie12
Whatever his battle of words with clubs is and it is a battle with Bruce Craig, not a battle with "clubs",

It is an issue with clubs both individually and as a group, just because BC is the most vociferous owner doesn't make him wrong. I suspect you don't like BC as an individual but don't confuse the two.

I believe Eddie has used BC as a distraction, I hope England win on Saturday but he does seem to make the odd strange selection sometimes, he needs to get it back on track as soon as possible!

Re: England Team First SA Test
Posted by: Barnetsarrie12 (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 13:17

Shipwrecked, I don't like or dislike Bruce Craig, I don't care about him in any way, he does not coach England and is not involved with my club team so I don't really care. I don't dislike him, why would i dislike him, I don't think i have ever given a second thought to him until this whole thing with Eddie started.

I am not saying he is wrong or Eddie is wrong, I am saying that Eddie Jones has only been going at one man and that is BC, whether that is a distraction or not is not my concern, I think the whole thing has been a distraction as this is something that needs to be discussed at the end of the season, not in the middle of a must win tour.

I do agree with you that Eddie makes some strange choices, even the team he picked on saturday has loads of gambles there.

First if either Itoje or Isiekwe gets injured, you are going to play Brad Shields who is not heavy and certainly not a lock in the game, that makes no sense to me. I also don't get Francis over Cips or Loz, Brown on the wing also makes no sense, brown has played on the wing many times for England and has been found out there over and over again so that is silly to me.

Despite all that, I hope we win on saturday, I think SA are favourites as they only lose at Ellis Park to NZ and even as bad as they have been in recent years, they have always pushed them close there and it's been less than a try deciding those games with the all blacks so England have it all to do on saturday.

Re: England Team First SA Test
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 13:22

Quote:
Barnetsarrie12
Haha Bath Matt trust me, I watched England when the team had no sarries players and will watch them when they have 23. It makes no difference to me and Sarries and England are 2 different teams and I take them and treat them as different entities.
I don't mind you saying you won't watch the game, no one can force you to watch, I had an issue with Nick saying he hoped we lost the game, to me that is not a great attitude to have because you don't like Eddie.

As much as I don't like Eddie and I don't as he is annoying most times, I want England to win always regardless of who is coach and those players have worked hard so, no way will I be hoping they go out there and "get stuffed"

I can see it from the point that, if we lost and it was a result of Mike Brown playing on the wing it could mean that we would never see him again in that position - particularly at the world cup when it really matters. One of those, cruel to be kind things...

So, maybe a one point win to England with MB having a stinker in that position, being subbed and his replacement scoring the winning try and making a saving tackle would suffice!

Re: England Team First SA Test
Posted by: Barnetsarrie12 (IP Logged)
Date: 07 June, 2018 13:25

If Mike Brown plays on the wing in an important WC match Matt, we are f*****

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