Current Page: 2 of 3
Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: northstand warrior (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 14:19

JP - I do appreciate the effort you have put in to establish the team last year had very little difference in strength, however:

I must not have put my point of view across properly, one of the reasons we are losing as you so rightly say is because we are not scoring tries, we are not scoring trying because of injury we do not have experienced playmakers at 9 and 10 on the pitch which also has meant a lack of continuity.

For the first 5 games last year we had the same scrum half starting in Johnny Arr with Luke Baldwin on the bench, that was for all of the first 5 games.

Fly half for the first 5 games last year was swapped between Tom Heathcote and Ryan Lamb and those two only.

This Year:

Falcons - Heathcote replaced by Olver on 55 mins
Wasps - Heathcote replaced by Olver on 43 mins
Chiefs - Heathcote replaced by Olver on 11 mins, replaced by Shillcock on 53 mins
Gloucs - Mills on four the whoel game, 3 tries and a losing bonus point away, considerably better than last year as I was there....
Sarries - Shillcock for the whole game

Therefore my point is there is a definitive reason this year that we are not scoring tries and winning, with players back from injury I think we are in a better place, and so from his later interview does Gary Gold.

Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: northstand warrior (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 14:20

D for E, exactly my point, thank you, see above

Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: wusstawizard (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 14:55

Quote:
KenDoddsDadsDogsDead
Lets merge with London Irish. Then one way or another we won't go down.
We'll get an identity and they'll get a ground.

I know this was a joke, but I really like this idea. Turn 2 struggling clubs with 2 bleak futures into 1 successful club with a very positive future. I'd rather be Worcester Irish than Worcester Warriors.

Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: FlipFlop (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 15:30

KDDDD,

Do you remember the furore last year when Racing Paris and Stade Francais suggested getting together.

Reading and Worcester are not the same city, but the newly formed club would jettison 20-30 players at a minimum, and both sets of supporters would argue over the 4 leaf Pear emblem until we died of boredom.

I see what you are getting at, but Rugby clubs tend to prefer to 'die' quietly and by themselves. Take a look at Nat Div 1 and 2 and see some once great names.Others are no longer. Cov are trying to steal themselves back now 'Hornets' are in the city.

I doubt any local club would want to be merged with us, and i extend that doubt to fellow Prem or Championship sides. They'd much prefer to see us implode and drop back down the leagues.

Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: Faithful_City (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 16:09

Who played 8, 9, and 10 the 1st 5 games last season

Posn.    Game 1.     Game 2.    Game 3.       Game 4.      Game 5
 08.     Alfie.      Alfie.     Dawson.      Alfie.       Alfie
 09.     Arr.        Arr.       Arr.         Arr.         Arr
 10.     Lamb.       Lamb.      Heathcote.   Shillcock.   Shillcock

JP

Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: northstand warrior (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 16:20

JP - unless Warriors have got their facts wrong, according to their website:

Game 4 was against Sale, Lamb was at fly half, shillcock was at full back and we had no fly half on the bench

Game 5 was against Falcons, Heathcote was fly half and Lamb came on at 52 minutes

This in my view is the difference between last year and this year.

Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: Faithful_City (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 18:01

Yep you are quite correct NW. my table lists starters and bench but not actual position, I take their known position. My table reall is to track numbers of starts and benches.

So pretty regular with Lamb, Heathcote and Arr, whereas this Season it has been Heathcote 60%, Shilly and Mills 20% each

JP

Edited an auto correction. The above is also % starters does not reflect playing time.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/10/2017 21:20 by Faithful_City.

Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: Touchliner (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 18:31

Quote:
northstand warrior
two pretty green 10s taking to the field

Quote:
Old Col
An interesting assessment (pity about the unneccessary adjective regarding 10's -Shilcock is a great prospect-just hope he does not have a sensetive nature ) .

Quote:
Faithful City
this Season it has been Heathcote 60%, Silly and Mills 20%

I think we are now pushing his ("Silly's") sensitivity a little too far!

I think we are also pushing the credibility of statistics a little too far as well. Since Olver has actually been on the field for 104 minutes (based on Northstand Warrior's rather more credible data!) he probably merits a mention since this represents 26% of the game time this season. The 60%, 20%, 20% referred to in the last quote actually represents the rather useless data of what percentage of the FIRST MINUTE of each game the players were at No. 10

Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: Warrior7 (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 18:48

Also Alfie did not start last season until he was sent off in the Gloucester game, where he was playing 6.
Agreed we did have more stability last year, but that information is pretty irrelevant.

Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: BrumBrum (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 19:46

Must admit, think we are being just a touch derogatory calling Shilcock "silly".
He is a young kid who last season was being talked as "our future" & we had "better not lose him". Now the same call him "silly", come on give the lad a break.

Am I being Sensitive or are some trying to make this predicament we find ourself in, into a full blown tragedy, with club on life support, destined for the Championship and going bust in a Day or two.
It just seems odd to me, when a Falcon supporter comes on and laughs at us for doing this ever year, with graphs, charts, comparisons etc.
I do recall similar posts last year but didn't really pay that much attention as I hardly posted, but is there an element of truth in what the Falcon supporter's said?
Are some just on suicide watch......again?

Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: Whispering_Death (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 20:02

Some are on suicide watch while many others have their head in the sand and live on another planet. Same old.

Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: w4rriorz1980 (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 21:13

Quote:
northstand warrior
Ok there a numerous threads on all the problems we feel we are facing but Gary Gold in his latest interview has stated he feels we are in a better position than we were last year.
I immediately laughed at this point but have spent like most, many an hour having a think, here is my positive spin on it all.

Off the Pitch
So we have lost near on 16 million over a period, a horrendous amount of money, however a good proportion of this has been spent on our facilities.

1. We own our own ground
2. There is room on this ground for further development to increase revenue, which is what is needed to compete in the league, look at London Welsh.

So our current owners wish to sell or look for further investment, can't blame them, but maybe it is not about them pulling the plug and walking away.

Bill Bolsover stated in his interview with BBC Hereford and Worcester that in order for Premiership Clubs to survive and be competitive they will need additional revenue streams, maybe the current major share holder does not want to plough more money in to achieve this and for the sake of the club, fans and all the staff has made this decision for the future and longevity of OUR CLUB, knowing that there will be a new owner out there wishing to take the club forward further.

We do know that Ed Griffiths had put an offer forward but Bill Bolsover mentioned that this was not accepted or not on the table for consideration as the current owners wish to find the right type of buyer.

Maybe, just maybe the offer was deemed not good enough for all concerned, I do not mean financialy but maybe their plan for the future was not for the good enough future of OUR CLUB.

So to sum up, maybe the current owners respectively are thinking about the future and not just about grabbing the best bid and running.

Let's take London Irish for example, they do not own their own ground, their gate receipts are less than ours, how are they going to fund that long term? We have already seen in the press they are looking for additional investment of 10 million, that is a 10 million gift surely, not an investment as currently they have no infrastructure to be able to increase revenue streams to pay it back.

The tide is turning in professional rugby, for those wanting to stay in the fight, will need to increase revenue from else where and we have the possibility of that happening, there are many other clubs in the Premiership who don't have that luxury.


On Field
Yeah, it's not been great has it from a results point of view? 5 losses, second in the league for most points conceded and least amount of points scored, we really are struggling to break defences down, so what's different from last year.

Injuries and lack of strength in depth, obviously. So why does Gary Gold think we are in a better place on field than last year?

Last year on pitch we looked pretty rudderless at times and so far this season despite two pretty green 10s taking to the field I feel we have a much greater structure about us.

Despite the injuries to the front row, our scrum and pack has not been demolished at all and these young players if they stay fit will only get better.

We have missed a decent 9, I have said this before, in todays game particularly with the rule changes a good 9 is more important than the 10 (the 10 or whoever takes kicks does need to have a good kicking percentage though)

The changes at ruck will suite Hougaard, Baldwin and Dowsett, both are quick to the breakdown and will snipe the fringes, not long before they will all be back now.

Last year we beat Sarries at home, an under strength Sarries that was, and despite their injury list this year personally I feel that was a stronger team, ours was pretty much full strength last year.

So with an under strength team we held them to 3 tries, previously this year their average had been 4.5 per game prior to last Friday, despite the loss I was not despondent.

We know we can score tries, but our two key playmaker positions have sustained injuries, and we have been unfortunate, personally I feel we only need one of those positions to be filled and we will see improved results, with both filled with experience who knows.

So we come to a new DOR, this is the first opportunity in years, to offer out the club, a club with a future and a good academy.

Gary Gold was bought in last minute to keep us up.
Dean Ryan, clearly stated he wasn't looking for a role as DOR at the time he was approached and despite his 5 year plan he obviously after a point didn't have his heart in it.
Richard Hill was bought in during the off season, in fact most of our DORs have been bought in during the summer break, we now have time and the opportunity to find the right person.

What I do hope is the club do not let me down on my thoughts of the above.

I know there will be many posters picking this apart after I post it, that is your prerogative, this is just my take on where we are at currently.
Made me feel better! You should be in politics!

Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: TeflonTed (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 21:16

BrumBrum, I'd wondered the same re. Shilly/Silly and had put it down to a typo.

Am I being naive?

For the record, whatever happens medium term, I repeat my often previously expressed opinion that Jamie Shillcock will turn out to be an exceptional player at fly half, and we'll be lucky to keep him.

Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: Faithful_City (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 21:18

Silly was a auto spelling correction. I have never called him that and never would, I believe he is one of our genuine rising stars.

JP

Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: Patgadd (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 21:30

Quote:
Faithful_City
Silly was a auto spelling correction. I have never called him that and never would, I believe he is one of our genuine rising stars.
JP

Wouldn't call him Shilly either. There does seem to be a lack of imagination in sporting nicknames. Any suggestions for alternatives? (Waiting for somebody to say Cocky)

Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: TeflonTed (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 21:45

Let's just call him Jamie.

As to waiting for Cocky, Mrs Ted says it's not usually worth the wait.

Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: Patgadd (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 21:48

Quote:
TeflonTed
Let's just call him Jamie.
As to waiting for Cocky, Mrs Ted says it's not usually worth the wait.

Mrs Patgadd says she's still waiting

Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: Eternal optimist (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 22:01

Quote:
Patgadd
Quote:
TeflonTed
Let's just call him Jamie.
As to waiting for Cocky, Mrs Ted says it's not usually worth the wait.

Mrs Patgadd says she's still waiting

Mrs eternally optimistic is still, waiting patiently.

Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: TeflonTed (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 22:24

Quote:
Eternal optimist
Quote:
Patgadd
Quote:
TeflonTed
Let's just call him Jamie.
As to waiting for Cocky, Mrs Ted says it's not usually worth the wait.

Mrs Patgadd says she's still waiting

Mrs eternally optimistic is still, waiting patiently.

Is this a matter of punctuation?

Is she "still", waiting patiently (i.e. not moving a lot?)

Or simply still waiting patiently?

Re: A Positive Spin
Posted by: knightstemplar (IP Logged)
Date: 05 October, 2017 22:25

Quote:
Eternal optimist
Quote:
Patgadd
Quote:
TeflonTed
Let's just call him Jamie.
As to waiting for Cocky, Mrs Ted says it's not usually worth the wait.

Mrs Patgadd says she's still waiting

Mrs eternally optimistic is still, waiting patiently.

Mrs Knightstemplar makes me sleep in the spare room when I suggest a wait

Current Page: 2 of 3
Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.
We record all IP addresses on the Sportnetwork message boards which may be required by the authorities in case of defamatory or abusive comment. We seek to monitor the Message Boards at regular intervals. We do not associate Sportnetwork with any of the comments and do not take responsibility for any statements or opinions expressed on the Message Boards. If you have any cause for concern over any material posted here please let us know as soon as possible by e-mailing abuse@sportnetwork.net