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One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: Petergwilson (IP Logged)
Date: 13 February, 2018 16:47

[www.bbc.co.uk]

World Rugby have announced that the Welsh try should have been given and the TMO got it wrong. Oops.

Re: One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: ricohchezwasp (IP Logged)
Date: 13 February, 2018 16:54

they still would have lost



Not a Doctor and not a troll!!

Re: One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: andy lee (IP Logged)
Date: 13 February, 2018 16:59

Despite the fact that the winger knocked in on before hand winking smiley

Re: One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: Trev's Big Tackle (IP Logged)
Date: 13 February, 2018 17:10

I doubt anyone expected Alain Rolland to agree with a decision given for the English against a celtish side.

There can't have been a proper review before that statement as there's a knock on. Probably just said "grounding looked okay to me" and the welsh have jumped all over it.

Re: One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: DGPWasp (IP Logged)
Date: 13 February, 2018 17:13

As TBT said, would expect nothing less from Rolland.

Re: One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: Lwasp (IP Logged)
Date: 13 February, 2018 18:09

Not sure what Howley is playing at. If this was a conversation as part of the regular feed back to teams it is surely in confidence? If you start to leak select parts of the feedback to the media you undermine the basis on which confidential feedback is given.

I'm not sure World Rugby wants to be seen to hang their refs out to dry publicly should they make a mistake (not saying this was, ultimately a mistake, that's being argued to death everywhere). Humans make mistakes and this won't be the last decision to be called in to question, but surely trial by media won't encourage anyone to step up and make these decisions???

Re: One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: bg (IP Logged)
Date: 13 February, 2018 20:00

The BBC article doesn't say World Rugby confirmed it was an error.. Alain Rolland from World Rugby said this to Howley.. but was that on World Rugby's behalf. I thought they never publicly aired views on officials' decisions ?

Re: One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: kentwasp1 (IP Logged)
Date: 13 February, 2018 20:04

Quote:
ricohchezwasp
they still would have lost

You found a crystal ball in the Aussie outback? From where I was sitting in the West Stand England were holding on for grim death and no way guaranteed to respond to the try

Please tell us the score for the Irish match we can put the DW kitty on (Sm101)

Re: One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: Speach (IP Logged)
Date: 13 February, 2018 23:40

One thing we definitely won't see is EJ saying "Fair does, seems Gatts had a point about the TMO error after all. My bad."



"Strategy without tactics is the slowest route to victory. Tactics without strategy is the noise before defeat."
Sun Tzu

Re: One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: Primrose Hillbilly (IP Logged)
Date: 14 February, 2018 08:12

Gives Wales all the added incentive they need for next year.

In the build up to that match, we will get this item endlessly brought up as a way of getting the Principality even more stoked.

"Arrogant English" - sorry Jim Telfer, I'm sure you won't mind lending your line.

Extra pressure on England to agree to the roof being closed as a way of making reparation.

Even were this to happen, that wouldn't kill it.

"We wuz robbed, now's our time to set things right"

"We played all the rugby, we deserved to win"

"Roger Quittenton robbed us of victory against New Zealand, and he was English"

Blah, blah, blah............

Re: One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: Raggs (IP Logged)
Date: 14 February, 2018 08:16

If nothing else changes, and they get the conversion, it's still 12-10. Of course things would have changed, but we can't know if that would have been England fighting back harder...

And there was a knock on from the winger anyway, so whilst the grounding was indeed fine, the try still should not have been allowed.

Re: One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: Petergwilson (IP Logged)
Date: 14 February, 2018 08:46

bg and TBT.


In a statement issued to BBC Sport Wales, World Rugby confirmed Howley's comments.

"World Rugby has clarified to the Wales team management as part of the usual review process with teams that the TMO made an error in the application of law during the England versus Wales match at Twickenham," it said.

"In accordance with law 21.1 b Wales should have been awarded a try as the Wales player grounded the ball."

I guess you know better than World Rugby.

Re: One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: Raggs (IP Logged)
Date: 14 February, 2018 08:49

World rugby are right, the ball was grounded.

Where they are still wrong, is that the winger knocked the ball on, before Anscombe grounded it.

Re: One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: Petergwilson (IP Logged)
Date: 14 February, 2018 08:50

Just not according to World Rugby. Maybe you should apply for a job there.

Re: One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: Raggs (IP Logged)
Date: 14 February, 2018 08:52

Quote:
Petergwilson
Just not according to World Rugby. Maybe you should apply for a job there.

World rugby didn't apparently review that bit again. However by world rugby's laws, the winger knocked it on. You can see the ball hits his finger, and is lost forwards, that's a knock on.

Re: One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: Trev's Big Tackle (IP Logged)
Date: 14 February, 2018 09:07

Can you point to world rugby addressing the knock on?

The grounding was fine. I said so at the time and was amazed it wasn't given. A-mazed it wasn't given. But, the more recent video clearly shows a knock on. If World Rugby is going to review the grounding after the game then you have to review both aspects the ref asked the TMO to check. The ref asked to check if there was a knock on, and if not was the grounding okay. World Rugby have ignored the ref asking the TMO about the knock on.

Edit to add: If the WR statement had something like "The "knock on" incident prior to the grounding was also reviewed and it was determined the ball went backwards off the welsh finger" or "the ball went from hand to shin and was therefore kicked forward" then I'd have a bit more faith in WR. They clearly didn't review the knock on and have left the ref hung out to dry.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 14/02/2018 09:22 by Trev's Big Tackle.

Re: One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: bg (IP Logged)
Date: 14 February, 2018 09:49

Quote:
Petergwilson
bg and TBT.

In a statement issued to BBC Sport Wales, World Rugby confirmed Howley's comments.

"World Rugby has clarified to the Wales team management as part of the usual review process with teams that the TMO made an error in the application of law during the England versus Wales match at Twickenham," it said.

"In accordance with law 21.1 b Wales should have been awarded a try as the Wales player grounded the ball."

I guess you know better than World Rugby.

I'm not disputing the fact the ball was grounded. I think it took most people 5 seconds viewing the reply to make their minds up on that. I'm just surprised World Rugby have publicly hung the TMO (and partly the ref who has 2 large stadium screens to view the footage ) out to dry.

Re: One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: Andy1210 (IP Logged)
Date: 14 February, 2018 10:20

Alain Rolland - say no more..

One thing I haven't been able to check but also think is relative is was the winger onside when the ball was kicked? Looked like he was ahead of the kicker at the time.

Re: One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: Raggs (IP Logged)
Date: 14 February, 2018 10:24

Quote:
Andy1210
Alain Rolland - say no more..
One thing I haven't been able to check but also think is relative is was the winger onside when the ball was kicked? Looked like he was ahead of the kicker at the time.

Nothing clear and obvious, I think he was fine.

Re: One to really annoy the Welsh
Posted by: StevieWasp (IP Logged)
Date: 14 February, 2018 10:42

Quote:
Trev's Big Tackle
Edit to add: If the WR statement had something like "The "knock on" incident prior to the grounding was also reviewed and it was determined the ball went backwards off the welsh finger" or "the ball went from hand to shin and was therefore kicked forward" then I'd have a bit more faith in WR. They clearly didn't review the knock on and have left the ref hung out to dry.

I know this was a hypothetical statement, but isn't that still a knock on with todays laws?

I think this is how they outlawed bouncing the ball off your knee. if it comes off your hand, even if it's backwards and then ricochez's off your leg forwards, then it's still a knock on.

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