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We should have won today!!
Posted by: Hollywood JK (IP Logged)
Date: 07 October, 2017 19:40

Just back from the game, and extremely frustrated with the result. We led for large parts, but switched off 15 minutes in the second half and they scored three tries from our mistakes...

They caught the ball from the restart and ran opposed to the try line. Tom Collins running from his own 10 metre line when he could have cleared conceding a penalty from which they scored a try from, then he completely misses a catch and Glos score from a what was nothing more than a speculative kick!! Not Tom's best game..

And I'm sorry this needs to be Harry's last game as a 10, time for him to revert to centre or full back. We had both Myler and Francis available. Why o why did neither of them start at 10??? It's just not acceptable Harry missing a kick in front of the posts on the 22 metre line. Criminal at this level, I could have kicked that, and made a difference when a game was this close!!

We lost this game. Glos didn't win it!! But we were not at the races. Need to step up and show some composure, albeit Wayne Barnes was his usual hopeless self missing several infringements when we were camped on their line in the first half!!! Grrrrrrrrr, 3 points dropped!!

Rant over.... (Sm73)

Re: We should have won today!!
Posted by: Deesaint (IP Logged)
Date: 07 October, 2017 19:50

It was always going to be a hugely challenging game against a seriously wounded Gloucester team who needed to restore some pride in front of their own supporters
I think it is work in progress/ we could have won but let ourselves down with some silly mistakes
Any change is likely to be tested - but I would rather support the present style that go back to the old stodgy of past two years
Now - is there a good defence coach available:-)

Re: We should have won today!!
Posted by: acl saint (IP Logged)
Date: 07 October, 2017 20:11

I think selection had a big part to play today.
Why keep Harry at 10?
Brooke's looks short of fitness!
They both had average/poor games last week and they still get first choice?
The momentum we had gathered was lost today on a very average Glos side.
These are the easier games we should win!!
Better player selection Jim!!!!

Re: We should have won today!!
Posted by: Saint For Life (IP Logged)
Date: 07 October, 2017 21:05

Quote:
acl saint
I think selection had a big part to play today.
Why keep Harry at 10?
Brooke's looks short of fitness!
They both had average/poor games last week and they still get first choice?
The momentum we had gathered was lost today on a very average Glos side.
These are the easier games we should win!!
Better player selection Jim!!!!

Gloucester have won 3 out of 3 at home so far - beating us , Worcester and Exeter . My gut feel tells me that Ackerman will ensure this home trend continues and I would be very surprised if Glaws lose more than a couple of league matches at home . IMHO they will be more than the average Glaws team at home of recent years . I do not accept Saints have lost momentum - great position after 6 games and I look forward to the rest of the league season . IMHO Harry has been good over the last 4weeks or so - I do not consider that he has had a poor game . I suspect both father and son do not see his future as fly half - however needs must and the reality is that neither our first two fly half choices have been available as a result of injuries . Both are now coming back to full match fitness and I suspect we will see more of them in the coming weeks . Better player selection ? - IMHO a rather naive throw away comment given availability / injuries / match fitness etc . I suspect we will start getting silly / OTT comments next about Jim favouring his son , undroppable etc My impression is that most rugby commentators recognise that Harry has the potential to be an absolute diamond - rough and not polished yet - but give him time and what fantastic experience he has already got this season .

Re: We should have won today!!
Posted by: Chris Hoddle (IP Logged)
Date: 07 October, 2017 22:23

Just back up
North.
Agree with Hollywood we should have won that game
When Mr Myler came on the kicking went up several notches.
Badly missed rob hornets defence he would have stopped at least two tries.
First time in a few years they have beaten us
Still next week we start again



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Re: We should have won today!!
Posted by: acl saint (IP Logged)
Date: 07 October, 2017 22:35

SFL
I never understand any player being played out of their best position, especially when we have a perfectly great 10 warming the bench.
Start with myler then change if you need to. Harry has been kicking away possession for weeks now to no avail.
As for selection, you must be pleased with Brooke's etc?
I wouldn't of rested any big names for this one as we've only just got going.
Myler kicking was different class when he finally got his chance.
4 points lost today.

Re: We should have won today!!
Posted by: Eif Jones (IP Logged)
Date: 08 October, 2017 03:19

Collins' ridiculous effort on the cross kick was a disaster at the time but more importantly is a disaster for the future. Any opposing DOR seeing that will have such a cross kick as an essential part of any game plan. Get practising Collins or things will pretty tricky for you.

Re: We should have won today!!
Posted by: Longers (IP Logged)
Date: 08 October, 2017 06:38

The start of the season has seen a significant weather change in the game plan and in its delivery. Today we fell off. Can't tell why, and very easy to get over-emotional!

We lost a great deal of intensity all around the park. Don't know why.
We lost a great deal of precision. Were we just getting carried away by the previous three games?
Elements of individuals' games - and I'm not singling out Harry, as he is not alone in this - show appallingly poor technique and rugby brains. Simply poor responses in certain areas of the pitch. Simply poor kicking and/or receiving.
Certain individuals looked "off the pace". Whether they had been wheeled back into the team too early, or needed a rest(!) I cannot tell. Was it physical or mental?

I think we should have won. I think we could have won. Hopefully we will learn from it.

Re: We should have won today!!
Posted by: Saintlyg (IP Logged)
Date: 08 October, 2017 06:41

I agree with HJK re Waynetta being his normal self. I also though that he (Wcool smiley blocked a couple of our players for the Heinz try that gave Glos the win but it's sport and that kinda thing happens
Always said that as a local, should Barnes be reffing a Glos match, he come from Cheltenham practically right nest door. Not really neutral is it.

Still we are still in the top four after 6 games, much better that the usuals said we would be. I will take that.

This wasn't a banana skin, we lost to a side that had 50+ points put on them last week and we know that feeling too well. They were fired up in front of their home fans. I was standing on the Stowford press terrace and can honestly say apart from the result, it was the friendliest away game I have experienced for some time. Great banter, good laughs, decent weather and really good to see my Glos friends again. Looking forward to going back next year (right horror trying to find a parking space though).

6 league games down , 16 to go. Lets hope we can stay where we are or better.

Re: We should have won today!!
Posted by: Baggy42 (IP Logged)
Date: 08 October, 2017 07:42

"Always said that as a local, should Barnes be reffing a Glos match, he come from Cheltenham practically right nest door. Not really neutral is it. "

got to be careful with comments like this (I am not sure if you were saying this in jest as you dont get context on this!) as we are questioning the mans integrity and professionalism - two things I think Barnes has in spades. The bloke is a top quality ref.

also we dont seem to mind when David Grasshoff is our TMO...

Re: We should have won today!!
Posted by: Tsar Brite (IP Logged)
Date: 08 October, 2017 08:12

Quote:
Baggy42
"Always said that as a local, should Barnes be reffing a Glos match, he come from Cheltenham practically right nest door. Not really neutral is it. "
got to be careful with comments like this (I am not sure if you were saying this in jest as you dont get context on this!) as we are questioning the mans integrity and professionalism - two things I think Barnes has in spades. The bloke is a top quality ref.

also we dont seem to mind when David Grasshoff is our TMO...
Wayne Barnes is from Bream in the the Forest of Dean not Cheltenham. When was the last time Mr Grassoff was appointed to a Saints game at Franklin Gardens ?

Re: We should have won today!!
Posted by: St tub (IP Logged)
Date: 08 October, 2017 09:21

Well done Glos

KB is ur best starter at 3
Stephen of s top drawer - as shown
Ribbans needs a rest
Backrow mix wasn't right
Luther isn't a 13 - we have to trust the squad or what is the point for Nafi, Tom et al

Re: We should have won today!!
Posted by: Mobbs (IP Logged)
Date: 08 October, 2017 09:47

Someone put up some stats last week with regard to our success rate with Waynes Barnes holding the whistle. I cannot seem to find the figuresI think it was a win ratio of about 30%. If that stat had applied to a Worcester or London Irish then it would have been understandable. The Saints have however been one of the more successful Premiership teams over the last ten years and as such you would expect a win ratio in excess of 50% with any particular referee. The disparity could therefore lie with either the official or the team with perhaps a combination of both. Certainly Mr Barnes has had a few howlers against us noticeably when Leicester are involved in the equation but he seems to have matured somewhat as a referee. Talking to some Gloucester players yesterday they were quite open insomuch that they prefer some officials to others and I guess thatis true of all players and coaches. Perhaps Saints have something of a mental block regarding Waynes Barnes and that allied to a very scrappy performance yesterday against a fired up Gloucester is why we lost?

Re: We should have won today!!
Posted by: headman (IP Logged)
Date: 08 October, 2017 10:59

Daisy and Tom Wood have had a rest. Time to bring them back. Need a bit of nous in the forwards

Re: We should have won today!!
Posted by: Walks11 (IP Logged)
Date: 08 October, 2017 11:26

Quote:
St tub
Well done Glos
KB is ur best starter at 3
Stephen of s top drawer - as shown
Ribbans needs a rest
Backrow mix wasn't right
Luther isn't a 13 - we have to trust the squad or what is the point for Nafi, Tom et al

You are right about Luther but suspect Jim felt it was the right thing to do in order too integrate Francis into the match day squad and also retaining Harry & Steven M in the squad. Bringing one of Nafi et al in would have meant dropping or not selecting one of the others.

IMO and said this last week, for all the good Harry does he is not a 10, his game management and kicking can go awry and we need some consistency in order to playing in the right areas of the field.

Hopefully Horne’s knock was precautionary with European matches coming up, but would like to see Francis, Burrell, Horne. Dropping Harry onto the bench would see Foden drop out of the 23 though

Re: We should have won today!!
Posted by: Guildford Saint (IP Logged)
Date: 08 October, 2017 11:29

Narrow bp loss away from home to a team smarting from a drubbing the week before. Never mind. Address the issues in training and move on. I'm not too concerned personally. Any team can beat any other on their day in the Prem now.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/10/2017 13:37 by Guildford Saint.

Re: We should have won today!!
Posted by: Severus (IP Logged)
Date: 08 October, 2017 14:08

Quote:
Saintlyg
I agree with HJK re Waynetta being his normal self. I also though that he (Wcool smiley blocked a couple of our players for the Heinz try that gave Glos the win but it's sport and that kinda thing happens
Always said that as a local, should Barnes be reffing a Glos match, he come from Cheltenham practically right nest door. Not really neutral is it.

Still we are still in the top four after 6 games, much better that the usuals said we would be. I will take that.

This wasn't a banana skin, we lost to a side that had 50+ points put on them last week and we know that feeling too well. They were fired up in front of their home fans. I was standing on the Stowford press terrace and can honestly say apart from the result, it was the friendliest away game I have experienced for some time. Great banter, good laughs, decent weather and really good to see my Glos friends again. Looking forward to going back next year (right horror trying to find a parking space though).

6 league games down , 16 to go. Lets hope we can stay where we are or better.

Interesting point re Barnes reffing his local club. There is a feeling around a Glaws that he is harsher on us than the opposition because he doesn’t want to be accused of favouritism. IMO this isn’t the case and I think he is one of the outstanding refs in world rugby. I have a few complaints about his reffing of the ruck in yesterday’s game as it nullified competition for the ball but seeing as there are some moans from both sets of fans he must have been pretty even. He should also be applauded for clamping down on chat from Williams when Hartley should’ve gone to the bin.

Re: We should have won today!!
Posted by: Duckonstilts (IP Logged)
Date: 09 October, 2017 09:16

It definitely seemed from the team sheet that Jim had an eye on next week. Looks like he has rested where needed and given a little time to players we will need to get anywhere in Europe.

A small loss might help fire the lads up for next week although getting revenge against Saracens so soon should be all the motivation we need.

I dont expect us to have a great run in Europe but getting a win against Saracens would set down a huge marker for the rest of the season.

We got a LBP away, thats fine. The table shows how well we started the season. Not perfect but better than most. At the end of the season the Bonus points start to add up.

Re: We should have won today!!
Posted by: Duncan Keene (IP Logged)
Date: 09 October, 2017 09:28

An interesting point on the local ref thing. I am very against it, and i don't think that is casting aspersions on the refs at all, it is just an unnecessary distraction in a professional age, as Severus says do the local refs over compensate for perceived potential bias? Do they try to ignore it but subconsciously thoughts creep in?

I didn't like it when Garner reffed Wasps, i don't like JP Doyle reffing London Irish, i don't like that as a Tigers fan we are in a group with Munster and our first two Euro cup games are reffed by an Ex-Munster player and a man born in Limerick.

There's loads of situations i'd look to avoid if appointing referees including both the local ref scenario and the overly repeated ref for the same fixture scenario (the Wayne Barnes for Tigers Saints situation), it just puts the already under pressure refs under more pressure.

Re: We should have won today!!
Posted by: Saintlyg (IP Logged)
Date: 09 October, 2017 11:12

Quite agree Duncan, that is what I was trying to portray in my earlier post. Why do the RFU or others unions appoint "local" ish referees. Surely that is putting pressure on the referee to start with, mind you I am sure WB can handle it. It just leave thing open to favouritism or over compensating against the local side.

Please let us have neutral referees for ALL games.

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