England Squad
Posted by: JMills (IP Logged)
Date: 20 January, 2020 12:11

Very strange selection. No recognised number 8 (no Sam Simmonds!), only 2 scrum halves (surely time to try someone else). Good to see Ted Hill and George Furbank called up but Umaga over Joe Simmonds is a bit of a surprise. Struggle to see how Tom Dunn is ahead of Thacker.

Forwards Luke Cowan-Dickie (Exeter Chiefs, 21 caps) Tom Curry (Sale Sharks, 19 caps) Tom Dunn (Exeter Chiefs, uncapped) Ben Earl (Saracens, uncapped) Charlie Ewels (Bath Rugby, 12 caps) Ellis Genge (Leicester Tigers, 14 caps) Jamie George (Saracens, 45 caps) Ted Hill (Worcester Warriors, 1 cap) Maro Itoje (Saracens, 34 caps) George Kruis (Saracens, 41 caps) Joe Launchbury (Wasps, 62 caps) Courtney Lawes (Northampton Saints, 81 caps) Lewis Ludlam (Northampton Saints, 6 caps) Joe Marler (Harlequins, 68 caps) Alex Moon (Northampton Saints, uncapped) Kyle Sinckler (Harlequins, 31 caps) Will Stuart (Bath Rugby, uncapped) Sam Underhill (Bath Rugby, 15 caps) Mako Vunipola (Saracens, 58 caps) Harry Williams (Exeter Chiefs, 18 caps)

Backs Elliot Daly (Saracens, 39 caps) Ollie Devoto (Exeter Chiefs, 1 cap) Fraser Dingwall (Northampton Saints, uncapped) Owen Farrell (Saracens, 79 caps) George Ford (Leicester Tigers, 65 caps) George Furbank (Northampton Saints, uncapped) Willi Heinz (Gloucester Rugby, 9 caps) Jonathan Joseph (Bath Rugby, 47 caps) Jonny May (Leicester Tigers, 52 caps) Ollie Thorley (Gloucester Rugby, uncapped) Manu Tuilagi (Leicester Tigers, 40 caps) Jacob Umaga (Wasps, uncapped) Anthony Watson (Bath Rugby, 42 caps) Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers, 95 caps)

Apprentice players Alex Mitchell (Northampton Saints, uncapped) Josh Hodge (Newcastle Falcons, uncapped)

Re: England Squad
Posted by: Rich. (IP Logged)
Date: 20 January, 2020 13:39

Yep some strange and weird calls. Understandably doesn't want to be picking a team for the next World Cup yet but to only have two scrum halves, one of who is 31 and a kiwi and argue shouldn't be playing anyway and the other one whose inability to pass accurately is always a big problem! He saw what happened in the world cup when one of his scrum-halves got injured.

Re: England Squad
Posted by: TimothyQ (IP Logged)
Date: 20 January, 2020 13:41

He clearly doesnít think much of the 8s available, I have no idea what Simmonds has to do! I expect it will be Curry or Earl at 8, canít really see an alternative. Umanga in front of Smith. No Willis, no Spencer. I thought Jonny Hill might have been in the camp as well.

I agree, itís a very odd selection! But he must know something I donít, I guess thatís what heís paid the big money for!

Re: England Squad
Posted by: Rinkadink (IP Logged)
Date: 20 January, 2020 14:24

Are we the only team to not have any players involved again?

Must be us who have the "poor relationship" with the RFU. In fairness, can you blame us after all the RFU has done to damage our club?

Re: England Squad
Posted by: gran (IP Logged)
Date: 20 January, 2020 14:33

Rinkadink it goes back to the days of John Blake, bill redwood and many many others over the years.

Re: England Squad
Posted by: youngone (IP Logged)
Date: 20 January, 2020 14:41

some of those i just don't get but then i am disintereted in this six nations... it has the feel of just being a good opportunity for all the new coaches/players to try some combos and get some game time together and it hasn't captured my interest at all.

I am selfishly glad that Hughes hasn't been selected but surely his omission is bad news for his international career in the future, he's been great for us and one of the stand out 8's in the league. Jones has instead gone for... a third openside!

Re: England Squad
Posted by: Rich. (IP Logged)
Date: 20 January, 2020 14:54

Thing is we want players to feel it will help their international ambitions to come to us/stay with us - and I'm sure it will the more we perform. Back in the day the nobs in London didn't fancy too many West Country players coming along and dropping their Hs and Gs, but no way is Eddie Jones not picking any player directly because of the club they play for.

What it does say yet again, however, is that if Bath really do have that many international level players then their coaching and leadership must be dreadful &/or they have brought in the wrong combination of players.

It also shows with Jones picking Dunn above Thacker that those hoping for an adventurous England, taking up the challenge of style of play shown by Japan, will not get their wishes.

Re: England Squad
Posted by: TimothyQ (IP Logged)
Date: 20 January, 2020 14:55

I doubt there is any deliberate snub against Bristol, I just donít think there were that many bris guys in contention:

Hughes - been around the block and it looks like EJ has made up his mind around him. I think heís a better player than last year, but Simmonds is the more surprising omission IMO.

Thacker - has been ignored for years because of his size, and I canít see that changing.

Randall - has struggled to hold down the bris shirt this season, fair enough.

Sheedy - Iíd actually have him before Umanga, but Iíd have Smith before both of them (just an opinion).

I had thought that Woolmore might have been an EJ left field selection, but they would have been a very eccentric pick.

In short, I canít see anyone in that list who was an obvious selection.

Re: England Squad
Posted by: Rinkadink (IP Logged)
Date: 20 January, 2020 15:05

World cup over, it was a failure (we didn't win) so why not have a big clear out or at least an experiment?

The likes of Dombrant and Thacker should be getting valuable experience IMO.

Re: England Squad
Posted by: Gray_Lensman (IP Logged)
Date: 20 January, 2020 15:33

Ben Youngs is completely beyond me. Hardly ever puts in a good performance, hasn't for a long while in truth, and is not going to be around for the next WC. There have to be other options.

Re: England Squad
Posted by: TimothyQ (IP Logged)
Date: 20 January, 2020 15:45

Quote:
Gray_Lensman
Ben Youngs is completely beyond me. Hardly ever puts in a good performance, hasn't for a long while in truth, and is not going to be around for the next WC. There have to be other options.

Itís a pretty damning indictment of Spencer. I always preferred Care to Youngs, but just because I like the game to be played at a high pace.

Re: England Squad
Posted by: Jim H (IP Logged)
Date: 20 January, 2020 17:02

Anyone know how to get some Dunn v Thacker stats? Can't see what Harry's done to upset Eddie.

Re: England Squad
Posted by: Sit_Down (IP Logged)
Date: 20 January, 2020 17:41

Thacker doesn't fit Eddie's game. That is all there is to it. Let's be honest, England don't lay free flowing attacking rugby. They play defensive, slow paced set piece orientated rugby generally. When they play at speed it is totally based on pre called phase play.

Re: England Squad
Posted by: Fridger (IP Logged)
Date: 20 January, 2020 19:22

Quote:
Jim H
Anyone know how to get some Dunn v Thacker stats? Can't see what Harry's done to upset Eddie.

Not sure about the stats but imagine that the fact that Harry insists on continually playing well in a Bristol shirt may be hampering his chances!

Re: England Squad
Posted by: James_P (IP Logged)
Date: 20 January, 2020 20:43

For me I imagine that given the lack of experience at 8 we might have gone more conservative on the scrum halves for the first game or two to help them bed in. Particularly against France where a loose game will play straight into their hands given how dangerous their backs are in broken play. Would expect to see a new 9 in further in the tournament although I may have that entirely incorrect.

Re: England Squad
Posted by: Chris@ndevon (IP Logged)
Date: 20 January, 2020 22:14

I really struggle with some of the selections. Dunn doesnít get a sniff at Chiefs. Hepburn however has been outstanding in the front row and is ignored. Think Eddie has got mixed up and picked the wrong Moon. England so short of scrum halves that I think it is a shame our boys missed out. Only other one I have been impressed with this.season is Stu Townsend at Exeter

Re: England Squad
Posted by: JMills (IP Logged)
Date: 21 January, 2020 09:21

Dunn struggles to get a look in at Exeter as he plays for Bath. The article has got it listed incorrectly. Still wouldn't have him in the squad over Thacker though.

Re: England Squad
Posted by: John Tee (IP Logged)
Date: 21 January, 2020 10:02

Its Jones....he is always a contrary picker.
I think he still has a job because of the nz game, and it may well be that we didnt perform as well in the final because of the cap scandal. I dont see much point keeping him around unless he is taking us to 2023 and im not fussed about the type of game he tries to play...which as said above is scripted.

Hughes is a good 8 but Jones found a balance....by mistake...on the SA tour without a typical big carrying 8 so will use Wilson there, imv, or someone similar.

Youngs is a joke but Heinz is older anyway...i think he has picked this squad for cohesion and known entities so he could always mix it up later in the series to get a look at more faces.
I think a livewire 9, to compliment Heinze, is required, balance the back row, with Curry and Underhill plus AN OTHER and put more dynamism in the front 3.
LCD for me, plus Genge and Sinckler, although he looks lost at Quins, and balance those with Srummagers. Dont think George has done much wrong, so no problem picking him but i far prefer LCD around ths field.

Locks, no problem.

FB is Watson, Daly makes the squad for utility, and when fit the wings are May and JC.

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