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OT/ Brexit
Posted by: woodpecker (IP Logged)
Date: 06 July, 2017 12:17

Rejoice!

EU and Japan have signed a trade deal:

[www.bbc.co.uk]



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 26/10/2019 08:46 by CoochieCoo.

Re: OT/ Brexit
Posted by: Substitute (IP Logged)
Date: 06 July, 2017 12:42

Wlell that totally makes political subservience worth it!

Re: OT/ Brexit
Posted by: gaz59 (IP Logged)
Date: 06 July, 2017 14:24

Before Boris gets wildly excited about the precedent this sets and expects the EU to roll over and beg us to tickle tummy, hope he reads the bit about 15 year transition

Re: OT/ Brexit
Posted by: DanWiley (IP Logged)
Date: 06 July, 2017 20:43

Quite fortunate that trade deals take time and usually aren't what was hoped for, otherwise we could have been in as position where Japan could sell cars to the EU tariff free and we couldn't.

Re: OT/ Brexit
Posted by: woodpecker (IP Logged)
Date: 07 July, 2017 08:49

What do you mean? We will be able to sign trade deals within weeks with India and the US

Re: OT/ Brexit
Posted by: TCM2007 (IP Logged)
Date: 07 July, 2017 13:24

Yikes. This is potentially terrible news, we could end up with Japanese car makers being better off manufacturing EU bound cars at home rather then here.



Stuart

Former ed.

Re: OT/ Brexit
Posted by: @Hydor18 (IP Logged)
Date: 07 July, 2017 13:28

Jeez, this goes from bad to worse.

Re: OT/ Brexit
Posted by: DanWiley (IP Logged)
Date: 07 July, 2017 13:42

It would be funny, schadenfreude in a kind of way, if it weren't happening to us.

"Wlell that totally makes political subservience worth it!"

Remind me of how being part of the EU affected you in a tangible way?

Re: OT/ Brexit
Posted by: BathPatriot (IP Logged)
Date: 09 July, 2017 15:47

Justice. The people will get what they deserve and they deserve what they get. No tears for the UK, they wanted their country back so crack on.

Re: OT/ Brexit
Posted by: @Hydor18 (IP Logged)
Date: 09 July, 2017 16:05

I work closely with the rural sector in Wales (I'm not Welsh, just to be clear!), and without a shadow of a doubt, Brexit will devastate UK agriculture.

90% of Welsh lamb exports are to the EU.
Most, if not all, upland farm incomes are underpinned by EU money.
Any trade deal with the US, Australia, New Zealand, or any number of South American countries will give them the right to sell their beef and lamb here, which they can produce more cheaply and are allowed to use growth hormones and antibiotics without regulation.

It's a perfect storm.

And yet the farming community voted en masse to leave the EU.

Could the phrase 'turkeys voting for Christmas' any more appropriate?

Re: OT/ Brexit
Posted by: BathPatriot (IP Logged)
Date: 09 July, 2017 23:24

Sorry, but what a load of total morons. Good points Hydor, more evidence of people's ignorance and anger riding roughshod over logic and self preservation.

Re: OT/ Brexit
Posted by: Substitute (IP Logged)
Date: 10 July, 2017 00:02

Quote:
@Hydor18
I work closely with the rural sector in Wales (I'm not Welsh, just to be clear!), and without a shadow of a doubt, Brexit will devastate UK agriculture.
90% of Welsh lamb exports are to the EU.
Most, if not all, upland farm incomes are underpinned by EU money.
Any trade deal with the US, Australia, New Zealand, or any number of South American countries will give them the right to sell their beef and lamb here, which they can produce more cheaply and are allowed to use growth hormones and antibiotics without regulation.

It's a perfect storm.

And yet the farming community voted en masse to leave the EU.

Could the phrase 'turkeys voting for Christmas' any more appropriate?

Yet we still give the EU more money than we receive. The tariffs on Lamb products (once the quota is allocated) are less than the change in the currency. Nowhere in the EU produces Lamb in the volume we do.

You'll probably know best - but surely British Lamb is quality and marketable...

The EU isn't a charity that supports our economy - it's a framework of rules and regulations for which we pay in order to ensure protection against external influence. If we leave and then apply the same framework, of course we'll lose out.

But then there are plenty of countries that survive without this framework (and they are wealthier per person than us). We have to change... bu then, it wasn't a vote for the status quo.

Re: OT/ Brexit
Posted by: @Hydor18 (IP Logged)
Date: 10 July, 2017 10:27

"Yet we still give the EU more money than we receive." I'm no an economist, but my understanding is that if every EU member received more than they gave, it would be considered a pyramid scheme.

It is a misnomer to suggest we should recover more than we pay because the reality is that what we pay in money from the taxpayers purse, we more than recover in tariff-free trade and commerce. I am far more supportive of this than I would the government being given a big lump of cash.

Yes, British lamb is considered a high quality product, but in the same vein as people shop in Lidl as opposed to Waitrose, if you can buy it cheaper, you will.

Obviously there are countries that exist perfectly well outside of the EU, but I am simply not convinced we will be enriching our own lives from exiting it. We do extremely well out of EU membership. The problem has always been that successive political parties have sought to paint it as a conduit for their own failings, and the press have been on the whole negative since year dot. Thus the population will always take a dim view of the EU, and that was borne out in last years' referendum.

What really bugs me is that I am considered a "remoaner", and am effectively told to pipe down because the option I voted for lost. Had the vote gone the other way, would those people criticising me now have just shrugged their shoulders and gone back to their day jobs? Not. A. Chance.

Re: OT/ Brexit
Posted by: Clarkey3k (IP Logged)
Date: 10 July, 2017 13:43

How people respond to change in organisations is illustrated very well by this image which can be easily overlaid on the country and those who voted last year. Each will know where he or she is in terms of how they feel now, and whilst there is a long way to go yet I remain optimistic about it...
http://cornerstone.rutgers.edu/sites/fst/files/Managing%20Change%20Curve.jpg



Adopted players: 2020/21 A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw

Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]

Re: OT/ Brexit
Posted by: @Hydor18 (IP Logged)
Date: 10 July, 2017 13:48

Note there is no limit as to the time...

Re: OT/ Brexit
Posted by: Clarkey3k (IP Logged)
Date: 10 July, 2017 14:12

Quote:
@Hydor18
Note there is no limit as to the time...

Correct, some people never come to terms with the change that has taken place...



Adopted players: 2020/21 A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw

Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]

Re: OT/ Brexit
Posted by: Which Tyler (IP Logged)
Date: 10 July, 2017 14:16

Also note that "acceptance" as pretty much everyone has accepted Brexit - doesn't mean that they agree with the decision, or that they should stop pointing out where processes could be improved etc etc.

There's a reason it's "acceptance" not "approval"



A man who cannot change his mind, cannot change anything
RAEBURN SHIELD




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/07/2017 14:17 by Which Tyler.

Re: OT/ Brexit
Posted by: Clarkey3k (IP Logged)
Date: 10 July, 2017 16:11

Quote:
Which Tyler
Also note that "acceptance" as pretty much everyone has accepted Brexit - doesn't mean that they agree with the decision, or that they should stop pointing out where processes could be improved etc etc.
There's a reason it's "acceptance" not "approval"

Acceptance in the context of the model usually means the staff have tried out the new structure/processes/changes to culture etc; buy into the new future then start to work towards achieving the new goals. The UK is not at that point in this cycle yet, people need to see what the Brexit deal is and live with it [experiment] before they can "accept" the new future.



Adopted players: 2020/21 A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw

Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]

Re: OT/ Brexit
Posted by: DanWiley (IP Logged)
Date: 10 July, 2017 16:20

Actually there's a branch in any sane model, that could happen anywhere, but I'd say often happen around experimentation where you ditch the change as its simply isn't working and the cost is seen to be dramatically higher than the benefit.

To carry on in such a situation because a picture told you to seems crazy.

Re: OT/ Brexit
Posted by: hemington (IP Logged)
Date: 10 July, 2017 17:03

The whole purpose of the change curve is to help managers understand how to pull their troops through the change. This is mainly done by being open and honest, listening, explaining and dealing with any questions as they arrive. I haven't seen a lot of that in this Brexit means Brexit (or is it Brexit means Red, blue, White and now Orange) world. No one seems to know what we want, what we are asking for and what we are going to get so the curve can't possibly work yet - everyone is on the down slope (although many wion't admit it)

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