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Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 10:13

Quote:
Optimist
Quote:
hasta
Both things can be true, Flats doesn't criticise, but Spencer probably is our best signing since Louw.

Spencer is our best signing since Redpath, who was our best signing since Stuart, who was our best signing since McConnoghie ...

All excellent players and hopefully will be for many years to come, but I feel like there has been a bit of quantum leap with Spencer in terms of what we needed to pull the whole together. His calm accuracy under pressure, quick service and genuine running threat seems to have made everyone around him bloom.



[Adoptee: Tom Doughty - dynamic hooker born in Brighton, made at Team Bath. Record for BUCS top try scorer within a season]

Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: charlieboa (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 10:18

Recruitment has been v astute recently. Last year boyce/stuart/judge/williams/mcnally.

This year schoeman, w spencer, b spencer, matavesi, redpath, muir

Jury still out on a few of them but so far most are in the 'roaring success' category for me.

Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: Optimist (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 11:04

Quote:
joethefanatic
Spencer probably is our best signing since Louw - A fact that will have been noted by the other teams. We're gonna need a Plan B. But Plan A has been a huge success.

One of the good things is that Chudley, in terms of style, is very much a Spencer like-for-like, and so, should one or other miss a period, there's no need to change playing style particularly. And the way our defence and set piece are at the moment, it's pretty unlikely that we're ever going to be chasing more than a score or two, so there's no real need to have a completely different option on the bench.

Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 11:21

Quote:
Optimist
Quote:
joethefanatic
Spencer probably is our best signing since Louw - A fact that will have been noted by the other teams. We're gonna need a Plan B. But Plan A has been a huge success.

One of the good things is that Chudley, in terms of style, is very much a Spencer like-for-like

Style maybe, but in terms of speed, accuracy and execution they are like chalk and cheese... Max Green is more like Spencer in terms of running threat and passing speed / quality IMO.



[Adoptee: Tom Doughty - dynamic hooker born in Brighton, made at Team Bath. Record for BUCS top try scorer within a season]

Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: Bath Supporter Jack (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 13:09

I acknowledge RP has been very good...................at what he does. He has in fact been better at what he does than normal.

Its just that we need more if we are to develop a Plan B as well as the currently very successful Plan A

Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: gaz59 (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 15:02

Quote:
Bath Supporter Jack
I acknowledge RP has been very good...................at what he does. He has in fact been better at what he does than normal.
Its just that we need more if we are to develop a Plan B as well as the currently very successful Plan A

+1

Couldn't have put it better, BSJ

Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: Optimist (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 15:11

Kind of hoping that current Plan A will become Plan B and that the new Plan A will involve a bit more singing and dancing.

Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: Bath Supporter Jack (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 15:14

But can RP sing and dance at the same time...................I know you can Opti(Sm22)

Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 15:34

For me RP has hugely benefited from having Spencer inside and CR / JM outside - this means that there is no real pressure on him to create anything magical as others are able to do it, he can then be a tactical and place kicking machine which tbf he was always rather good at. (i.e. Our gaze / playmaking expectation is largely off him).



[Adoptee: Tom Doughty - dynamic hooker born in Brighton, made at Team Bath. Record for BUCS top try scorer within a season]

Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: Optimist (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 15:37

I'd say RP's humming pleasantly and skipping cheerfully, rather than singing and dancing. Me - I'm squawking and hobbling!

Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: Bathovalballer (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 22:48

So what is Mr Dempsey doing or adding to the party? Yes RP has been very good (at goal kicking and libs kicking) but not so much in getting the line moving. Spencer with his miss passes has added much more, and makes RP look good. Without Mr S I wonder if we would be in the position we are now. Not that I am decrying it, just want to see more flowing backs moves from a talented group of individuals.



Adopted player 2020/21 Beno 'the Transformer' Obano


Adopted player 2019/20 Jonathan 'JJ' Joseph.The Jink Joseph.
Adopted player 2018/19 Adopted player 2018/19 Semesa 'The Rock' Rokoduguni

Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: Bath Hammer (IP Logged)
Date: 16 September, 2020 08:09

Quote:
Bathovalballer
So what is Mr Dempsey doing or adding to the party? Yes RP has been very good (at goal kicking and libs kicking) but not so much in getting the line moving. Spencer with his miss passes has added much more, and makes RP look good. Without Mr S I wonder if we would be in the position we are now. Not that I am decrying it, just want to see more flowing backs moves from a talented group of individuals.

+ 1 By now I would have been expecting our back line to be more like Leinster at their pomp

Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: hasta (IP Logged)
Date: 16 September, 2020 08:16

What I want is stable, consistent improvement, not us rapidly getting better and then worse again (a la Glaws/Saints). I remain unconvinced that Dempsey is right for the job, but there are signs of our layering an attacking game plan on top of our pack/kicking/defense plans.

Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: Bath Supporter Jack (IP Logged)
Date: 16 September, 2020 08:21

To be fair to Mr Dempsey..................we now have a set piece that is 95% certain of winning line out ball and very likely to win controlled quality scrum ball.....................we also have a scrumhalf who gets on with it.

The effect of this is that RP and the backs have an extra "second"....................that is really important!

Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: Optimist (IP Logged)
Date: 16 September, 2020 09:04

Quote:
Bath Supporter Jack
To be fair to Mr Dempsey..................we now have a set piece that is 95% certain of winning line out ball and very likely to win controlled quality scrum ball.....................we also have a scrumhalf who gets on with it.
The effect of this is that RP and the backs have an extra "second"....................that is really important!

Iíd say thatís precisely the opposite of being Ďfairí to Mr Dempsey. All of what you evidence makes him look even worse. If you canít produce coherent attacking backs play from that set of advantages then itís hard to imagine you ever will.

Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: gaz59 (IP Logged)
Date: 16 September, 2020 09:10

Quote:
Optimist
Quote:
Bath Supporter Jack
To be fair to Mr Dempsey..................we now have a set piece that is 95% certain of winning line out ball and very likely to win controlled quality scrum ball.....................we also have a scrumhalf who gets on with it.
The effect of this is that RP and the backs have an extra "second"....................that is really important!

Iíd say thatís precisely the opposite of being Ďfairí to Mr Dempsey. All of what you evidence makes him look even worse. If you canít produce coherent attacking backs play from that set of advantages then itís hard to imagine you ever will.

Well Freddie in his recent interview would seem to disagree. He says Dempsey is a good coach with great ideas but is constrained by Hooper and Hatley

That may be a myopic perception but it is either true and Dempsey has the ability and vision for something more exciting and is content, for time being at least, to go along with the 'layered' strategy or it isn't and Hooper is content with an underperforming attack coach

Still very odd, whichever reality you buy

Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: BathMatt53 (IP Logged)
Date: 16 September, 2020 09:16

Quote:
gaz59
Well Freddie in his recent interview would seem to disagree. He says Dempsey is a good coach with great ideas but is constrained by Hooper and Hatley.
That may be a myopic perception...

Yes I read that interview and felt a bit sad / disappointed that he is still having a gripe about how it all wasn't fair and how he wasn't given a chance to become one of the very best 10s in the world. IMO he came across as bitter and a bit deluded which is a shame, whether he has a point or not, because I have been a big fan in the past. The sooner that he can get to Japan and start scoring some points for his new team the better he will feel, I'm sure.

[Edit: apologies I see that this also crosses the 'gainsayers' thread]



[Adoptee: Tom Doughty - dynamic hooker born in Brighton, made at Team Bath. Record for BUCS top try scorer within a season]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 16/09/2020 09:17 by BathMatt53.

Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: Never In Doubt (IP Logged)
Date: 16 September, 2020 09:22

I am willing to give Dempsey a break until the end of the season (at least). I think back development was de-prioritised, or hampered by lack of quality possession, until other fundamentals were in place. I think we are now seeing an improvement and I am willing to be take a breathe and see where we get to in the rest of the season.

Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: gaz59 (IP Logged)
Date: 16 September, 2020 09:26

You wouldn't describe our tries against Sale as coming straight out of an attack play book but all four were made and finished by the backs

And I don't think any of them went through the fly half

Maybe that's our attack strategy, more opportunistic than rehearsed?

Re: 5 into 4 : Sale v Bath Match Preview TEAM'S UP!
Posted by: Optimist (IP Logged)
Date: 16 September, 2020 09:47

Gaz: 'He says Dempsey is a good coach with great ideas but is constrained by Hooper and Hatley' - I didn't read/hear that, but that sounds pretty credible.

NID: 'I think back development was de-prioritised' - that also sounds like a reasonable interpretation (and possibly a reasonable approach).

Gaz: 'Maybe that's our attack strategy, more opportunistic than rehearsed?' .... also agree that this is probably true - our aggressive defence has 'created' a lot of opportunities.

With Hooper's authority at an all-time high, it's fair to say that his approach has been vindicated, and so I do feel as though we can expect to see more attacking options layered on in the coming months.

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