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Re: Ampthill Scores
Posted by: HoboAl (IP Logged)
Date: 12 January, 2020 19:01

Quote:
Wazeroonie
If two conversion attempts hadn’t been missed Cov would have won. I wasn’t there so it might not be that simple.

Conditions were very difficult for the kickers. However Grimoldby made difficult kicks look easy in same conditions.

I still think with the amount of possession we had in both halves in their 22, we should have won at a canter and kicking should not have been an issue. We dont seem to know how to really turn the screw and really punish teams. Decision making?

Re: Ampthill Scores
Posted by: PaulRossborough (IP Logged)
Date: 12 January, 2020 19:08

I wasnt there yesterday, thankfully so cannot comment on the performance.

I did make a comment on Twitter that we should not be losing against Ampthill. I have subsequently considered this comment. It may come across as arrogant but I genuinely feel this. As is often the case, it is when we play those teams at the bottom of the league that I am less confident going into games.

I'm not saying any of this was the fault of anyone at FH yesterday, for us to progress in this league, I feel we need a better 10. They both have good points about them and I dont think they're bad players but I have felt this is where we need to recruit both this year and last.
Fenner; I think he is a very good and committed player but not 1st choice 10, in my view.



All views expressed in this post, are my own

Re: Ampthill Scores
Posted by: Straightout (IP Logged)
Date: 13 January, 2020 10:12

Do you not think Jennings is quite good enough Paul? I agree Will and Fenner are not a top 2 champ fly half but Jennings has the pedigree

Re: Ampthill Scores
Posted by: CharlieBravo (IP Logged)
Date: 13 January, 2020 11:03

Straight out - I realise you’re asking the question of Paul, but can I add my twopennuth?
We’ve not seen much of Fenner at flyhalf, and Saturday probably proved why. His kickoff to start the game, playing down the hill and with a strong wind, went straight out of play behind the posts. He had been out there in the warm up and had been practicing his kicks and has to have been aware of the strength of the wind, so why did he kickoff the game with such a strong kick? He missed the conversion of Andy B’s try, again because he completely misjudged the wind, and his distribution was poor. He didn’t bring the backs into the game, he passed to players who were standing still and as a result there was no generation of pace and commitment from players who should have seen so much more of the action. We hardly saw Henry Purdy, Will Owen, Rob Knox, Max Trimble (other than his interception try), Andy Forsyth (when he came on during the second half). In my opinion, it was certainly not a good day at the office for Tony Fenner, and reinforced my view that he should not be our first choice fly half.
All this is purely my opinion, of course.

Re: Ampthill Scores
Posted by: Rob C (IP Logged)
Date: 13 January, 2020 12:16

Quote:
Straightout
Do you not think Jennings is quite good enough Paul? I agree Will and Fenner are not a top 2 champ fly half but Jennings has the pedigree

Problem is Jennings is probably our best distributer at 12 as well...

Re: Ampthill Scores
Posted by: tonker (IP Logged)
Date: 13 January, 2020 13:04

fenner perhaps started at 10 for his defensive qualities. amptill like to run their forwards at the fringes time & time again.

Re: Ampthill Scores
Posted by: Straightout (IP Logged)
Date: 13 January, 2020 13:25

Thanks Cliff and others.. good points made. Jennings is a good defender, hence capable at 12 too and is a good distributor as has been said. He is not the finished article but was Def bought to solve the 10 problem of having a higher class operator there. I can’t imagine the club will be looking to get someone else in as he has made a good start too to his career with us. We do lack a top class ball playing 12 so he does get moved across. As a wider debate it is interesting (and disappointing) that we are still not quite good enough to win some games we should really be winning with more comfort. We prob all had a niggling doubt that we may come unstuck on sat even though we had a v strong side on paper. Even with a near prem class backrow and most of our best players in we still can’t seem to be sure of beating the likes of ampthill away who let’s face it have a much smaller budget than us.. they have done superbly well in their first year and were a junior club a few years ago which makes it sound worse as they are not a big club. Maybe we are 2 or 3 players away still from consistently winning each game we should away. Not sure what position they should be in but I would say a top class 12, Jennings played in his right position and maybe a real enforcer and experienced second row. 13 to is debateable although we all know how good rob Knox could become or maybe Forsyth is the answer there. Stevens is good and solid but not top 2 level probably. We lack an outstanding skilful midfielder I think. To unlock the real potential we have out wide in purdy and Trimble. I expect Us to win all our home games apart from falcons which will be close due to crowd and raising our game. What two or three positions do people think we need improving to stop us waking up feeling gutted that that niggling doubt is realised and we lose to Ampthill (or a jersey etc away)? Maybe it’s experience as a team more than new players. And maybe Fenners off day was the diff on Saturday. Jennings isn’t the finished article so maybe another year under his belt will give us that real confidence at 10.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 13/01/2020 13:36 by Straightout.

Re: Ampthill Scores
Posted by: Moosemagic (IP Logged)
Date: 13 January, 2020 13:44

Interesting comments on here regarding Tony Fenner, according to the Rugby paper he was our MOM and they scored him 8/10.

Re: Ampthill Scores
Posted by: John Butler (IP Logged)
Date: 14 January, 2020 20:20

You can take the player ratings with a pinch of salt, whichever way you want to interpret them. All down as well to the differing views of correspondents as to how they rate players.
Some start with a 5 as a base, others 6 & so on, just ask JW !

Re: Ampthill Scores
Posted by: HoboAl (IP Logged)
Date: 17 January, 2020 18:22

Quote:
Moosemagic
Interesting comments on here regarding Tony Fenner, according to the Rugby paper he was our MOM and they scored him 8/10.

According to the Rugby Paper Ratu Bulumakau scored our first try.

Re: Ampthill Scores
Posted by: AdminBTCov (IP Logged)
Date: 17 January, 2020 18:26

Quote:
HoboAl
Quote:
Moosemagic
Interesting comments on here regarding Tony Fenner, according to the Rugby paper he was our MOM and they scored him 8/10.

According to the Rugby Paper Ratu Bulumakau scored our first try.
Ha. Did well then, playing on crutches!

Re: Ampthill Scores
Posted by: titchywinger (IP Logged)
Date: 17 January, 2020 22:41

According to the highlights, superb skill shown by Tony Fenner in the lead up to the Andy Bulumakau try.

Re: Ampthill Scores
Posted by: HoboAl (IP Logged)
Date: 18 January, 2020 08:21

Perhaps we need to remember that Rory Jennings has only just turned 24 so only months rather than years older than Dan Lewis 23.

Both are very good players with the prospect of becoming excellent players in a Coventry shirt. Fenner perhaps deserves a few games at 10 before we judge.

This sort of competion for the shirt is also what Will Maisey needs to develop further at this level. I would rather see us develop a couple of 10's over the next few years rather than go out and acquire the finished article.

Re: Ampthill Scores
Posted by: NOM (IP Logged)
Date: 18 January, 2020 08:59

100% agree that we should develop our own but they do need meaningful game time - playing games is where experience and skill is best gained. Keeping a large squad happy is the toughest challenge for DoR/Head Coach.

On the age point - how old is old enough? Is this not a dated argument given most talented lads were in professional academies from 14/15 years old (Jennings-Bath, Flinn-Chiefs/Bath, Russell-Tigers etc etc). Players now 22-24 have had 8 -10 years in the professional pathway so surely they can only progress further with meaningful game time?

I appreciate this point then polarises the discussion - ‘Champ experienced squad today vs Prem ready squad for tomorrow’ #

#caveat that if Saracens come down - tomorrow can wait a further year smiling smiley.

Re: Ampthill Scores
Posted by: HoboAl (IP Logged)
Date: 18 January, 2020 09:10

Agree they need gametime. But they only get that if fans don't keep hankering after someone better in that position or the expectation of promotion in three years. 'Premiership ready' and promoted are not the samething in my book.

Re: Ampthill Scores
Posted by: NOM (IP Logged)
Date: 18 January, 2020 09:33

Agree there is a clear distinction between promotion and ready. It then becomes chicken and egg - results today with ‘older’ players that have a less room to grow/time to contribute or invest game time in ‘younger’ players with more growing room/time to give.

Can anyone recall the ages of the Cov players from the halcyon days that ended up with several internationals - my club history does not stretch back that far but I suspect they weren’t waiting for 1st xv games until they were 25/26?

More recent examples (Chiefs and Sarries) suggest long term success on the field requires a less ‘ageist’ selection policy.

Re: Ampthill Scores
Posted by: HoboAl (IP Logged)
Date: 18 January, 2020 10:09

A bit apples and pears. Years ago most players were one club players or at least played for clubs in a certain area. Now professional cash driven rugby means players move from club to club even country to country.

There is the good and the bad in both worlds. There is an argument for if you are good enough you are old enough. However just because one player is ready at 18, 20 or 22 doesn't mean all players will be.

Re: Ampthill Scores
Posted by: NOM (IP Logged)
Date: 18 January, 2020 10:32

Fair point - how about a more recent example. Ampthill home before Xmas compared to last week. 5 younger lads in Cup game and produced what one poster described as the best rugby seen in the BPA era - 6 weeks later no younger players starting (1 on bench I think) and we know what happened.

Hardly empirical evidence (cup vs league, home vs away but the results against pretty much the same side speak for themselves). To answer your point about age/readiness in my opinion these boys are ready. It would be good to see them get a chance rather than replacements brought in for Purdy and Stokes.

A lot of hot air from me for a Saturday morning and for all that I am looking forward to watching TF and the team today and making amends for last week!

Re: Ampthill Scores
Posted by: HoboAl (IP Logged)
Date: 18 January, 2020 11:39

I too am looking forward to todays game. I think we will go with what we have got until the end of the season and players will get their chance. Dan Lewis recently said to me "I havent played at that many clubs, but it is the only club, when coaches say if you train hard and do well on loan you will get a chance in the first team - and they mean it."

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