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Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: Saint James (IP Logged)
Date: 28 May, 2020 11:54

Jack Willis would have been an ideal replacement for Brussow, obviously just resigned at wasps. Like to think we tried to tempt him out way.

Nick will be a useful addition for sure but beg different sort of player.

Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: Chris Hoddle (IP Logged)
Date: 28 May, 2020 12:36

So if he plays for us and managed to break into the England set up can he then go back to Saracens so he is unavailable for them whist playing for England?



http://chrishoddle.smugmug.com/photos/i-TsCHdzK/0/M/i-TsCHdzK-M.gif

Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: DrHankPym(superhero) (IP Logged)
Date: 28 May, 2020 13:10

Quote:
Chris Hoddle
So if he plays for us and managed to break into the England set up can he then go back to Saracens so he is unavailable for them whist playing for England?

Not sure how that works. He's signed on loan to you guys for a season, any international call up means he's missing games for Saints.



If winning isn't everything, why do they keep score? - Vince Lombardi

Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: Stockers (IP Logged)
Date: 28 May, 2020 15:30

Heaven forfend that Nick (welcome by the way) may actually bring some useful insights into team training, culture and training practices that Saints may find useful in emulating one of the most successful squads in recent seasons.

And that isn't to excuse the flagrant breaches of SC but you can't ignore that they know some useful stuff, playing wise.

My only puzzlement is that he is a "replacement for Brussouw." He may be a 6 but he sure ain't a pure 7.

Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: OldMarovian (IP Logged)
Date: 28 May, 2020 16:17

Quote:
Chris Hoddle
So if he plays for us and managed to break into the England set up can he then go back to Saracens so he is unavailable for them whist playing for England?

Pretty sure if that happens you have to loan Saracens Lawes for the rest of the season (Sm100)

Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: Hymenoptera (IP Logged)
Date: 28 May, 2020 18:23

Helping Sarries out aside..Your not telling me that given the state of the market and potential signings out there that there was no better option than taking this guy on loan...pull the other one

Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: John Tee (IP Logged)
Date: 28 May, 2020 18:30

Quote:
tedge
What'll happen to his 4 year deal if Saracens fail to gain promotion, or if ring fencing (indicated by John White that it will happen sooner rather than later) is introduced before they get back up ?

Never going to happen...
A) I think they'll easily get promoted anyway
cool smiley England will never do anything at all to hinder access to the players they want.

If clubs had wanted, or realised, the big sanction, they would have cherry picked most of their players by signing them, not loaning them.
If players are moving across on loan, after signing a long term deal,
then they arent committed at all. I don't say they wont play hard or be professional but they've been rented out, thats all. They didnt want it that way.

Clubs needed to collectively say no to loans, and they didnt.
They'll get most of their squad back after promotion.

Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: smitferbrainz (IP Logged)
Date: 28 May, 2020 18:49

Quote:
NobbyClarke
Nick is most definitely a useful addition to the squad, let's forget where he came from (and where he is probably going to) and welcome him into the Saints family. For me as long as he does his shift he deserves the same thanks and admiration as the rest of the boys. Wasn't it great to see Victor Matfield in the GB&G for a season? Think of it in the same way and enjoy what he can bring to the party.

He hardly played as I remember. Iím sure there was some rumblings that Mr West wanted nothing to do with him. Didnít he end up training with the academy. I may be wrong but it didnít seem to have been much of a success.

Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: OldMarovian (IP Logged)
Date: 28 May, 2020 19:19

Thankfully for Saints West is gone (I'm sure he was right and the team and a jobbing forwards coach could learn nothing from one of the best lineout locks in the World) I get the feeling your current set up with the very good Boyd at the helm will get the maximum benefit for Saints out of any players under them rather than let their egos rule.

I know it's a different scenario but this does make me think a bit about Calum Clark joining us. I think it would be fair to say he came with a bit of a reputation and many supporters were fairly skeptical.
I'm not sure if his time at Saracens has worked out exactly as he imagined but when he has played he's played well and when I've had the pleasure of speaking with him after games his enthusiasm especially for the mentorship role he has been given with Academy players really shone through. I hope in a season's time the doubters will feel the same about Isiekwes contribution to Saints.

Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: Longers (IP Logged)
Date: 28 May, 2020 20:49

Quote:
Hymenoptera
Helping Sarries out aside..Your not telling me that given the state of the market and potential signings out there that there was no better option than taking this guy on loan...pull the other one

I'm no fan of this deal, but I understand that Boyd had said that he had yet to find a satisfactory replacement for Brussow, and this would give him an extra 12 months.

Now either Boyd is tellling porkie pies - and somehow, given his record I doubt that - or you should withdraw the comment about pulling your other one?

Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: Brackleysaint (IP Logged)
Date: 28 May, 2020 21:10

I still think Brad Shields is part of the equation!

Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: Saint Maul (IP Logged)
Date: 28 May, 2020 22:57

PROS
- Adds power/strength to our pack
- Hard as nails and gives his all
- Versatile covering 6 and 2nd row - a fantastic bench option
- Gives Boyd time to find his replacement (or agree terms with the player he wants whose contract finishes in a year's time?)

CONS
- He is a better 6 than 2nd row for me. 6 isn't where we need cover with Wood, Gibson, Lawes, Coles, Ludlum, Harrison, Tonks all good at 6 (compare if Harrison gets a long injury lay off we will be exposed at 8 far more than a first team injury at 6)
- a one year contract is undesirable for so many reasons: It takes time to embed in a new team and get best value from a player, particularly if training is more limited; We shoulder his significany pay from July even if games don't start before 2021 and he gets international call ups; It provides inside intelligence about Saints for Sarries on his return; Our actions by signing him on loan have†† helped Sarries maintain a squad they were only able to build through cheating which feels wrong

Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: tedge (IP Logged)
Date: 29 May, 2020 09:16


Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: Longers (IP Logged)
Date: 29 May, 2020 14:59

Quote:

which makes perfect sense and fits nicely with my own somewhat negative reaction to the signing.

Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: Saint Maul (IP Logged)
Date: 30 May, 2020 07:30

I hear Boyd's explanation that signing Nick is a short-term solution giving youngsters like Coles and Tonks another year to develop. It's pragmatic.

However, even with this explanation it still feels wrong. Supporters at other clubs can fairly feel aggrieved at Saints and Bristol's self-serving actions undermining the impact of sanctions against Sarries.

As a direct result of Saints and Bristol actions, Sarries will be able to maintain a future squad that they were only able to develop through cheating. If all clubs had collectively refused loan players Sarries would have had no choice but to release players which they now get to keep. Saints have broken ranks and actively aided and abetted Sarries to circumvent the intended impact of the demotion sanction.

Nothing against Nick, but the more I reflect on this, the more I don't like it and think it reflects poorly on Saints. Just my view.

Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: shendy (IP Logged)
Date: 30 May, 2020 09:16

Saints and Bristol aren't the only sides to have announced loanees from Sarries, are they?

Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: PelerinStJames (IP Logged)
Date: 30 May, 2020 09:19

So when does he join us? Is it 1st July (which is when Cobus leaves to join Montpellier) or after the conclusion of the 19/20 season whenever that may be? Even then is it at the conclusion English league or after the Champions Cup if sarries or Saints are still involved. If Saints ended up playing Sarries in the ECC, who would he play for?

Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: Saint Stokey (IP Logged)
Date: 30 May, 2020 10:18

I know it's not an ideal situation but it sounds like a last option for us.

We may be getting a reduced cost near international player who, by the sounds of it will be used to allow our younger player an opportunity to progress properly.

As for helping Sarries keep their squad, if we hadn't taken Nick, he'd either have gone elsewhere or stayed with Sarries so he'd be part of their squad next season regardless.

In fact, with most of the senior players staying, they are getting a 'sabbatical' which Nick won't have the luxury of. Regardless, when /if he returns to Sarries, they will still have to fit him within their salary cap which will be even harder if he make the England team proper and demands higher wages.

Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: shendy (IP Logged)
Date: 30 May, 2020 11:17

Quote:
shendy
Saints and Bristol aren't the only sides to have announced loanees from Sarries, are they?

To answer my own question...
The Sarries board says that Singleton is going to Gloucester on loan, so it's not just Saints & Bristol.

Re: Boydy confirms Isiekwe loan
Posted by: Bob (IP Logged)
Date: 30 May, 2020 12:12

Who is going to play at 8 when T gets injured or burns out. And then think of third choice when that replacement gets injured.

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