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Loosehead injuries
Posted by: BuckSt (IP Logged)
Date: 14 September, 2020 20:11

Just thinking along with other problems we seem to have a long-standing issue over the last season with Loosehead injuries. Before COVID we were down to Gordon Reid as injury cover, now we have 4 injured, 2 with Achilles problems.

If any of you listen to EggChasers podcast a source that is linked to Sale seems to suggest Saints are doing things when setting up that mean they are going to “brace” rather then try to push forward - I wonder is this “technique” causing stress on the Achilles or other mechanical strains that increase the chance of injury specifically to a loosehead?

Re: Loosehead injuries
Posted by: Buzzardsaint (IP Logged)
Date: 14 September, 2020 21:14

There's a story by Chris Jones on the BBC site stating We may not be allowed to sign another loose head so the poor young lad may have to play 80 or its uncontested scrums and down to 14.... What a miserable Sunday this will be.

Re: Loosehead injuries
Posted by: Dragonboy (IP Logged)
Date: 14 September, 2020 21:16

Just read on a google post that potentially if we have no loose head cover for Manny assuming he is our 1 on Sunday then if is injured we go down to 14. This is tantamount to forcing the club to name and play a 3 out of position at 1. Now I played 1 and sometimes 3 at Junior club level and the positions are totally different so this is potentially forcing someone to play out of position with all of the inherent safety implications. Apparently no changes to the squads are possible - even assuming someone was available fit and Covid free - after 1st September. So the rules rule to the detriment of safety issues it would seem. I’m actually thinking shame on the European organisers.

Re: Loosehead injuries
Posted by: TringSaint (IP Logged)
Date: 14 September, 2020 21:55

I was a LH and occasionally played hooker but never TH as I was very left leg biased, so my drive came from that side, so putting me on the TH side would have been marginally better than putting a winger in there. Plus I liked my ears and didn’t fancy having two congealed lumps of gristle stuck to either side of my head!!

So simply dumping someone in that position is not good against a fully functioning scrum as they are more likely to get injured if they are way down on power (probably the main reason we have so many prop injuries Tbh).

I would absolutely take the loss of a man and remove all scrum penalties from the match and make the scrum nothing more than a league scrum and allow us to defend open play attacks.

Re: Loosehead injuries
Posted by: Saint Ted (IP Logged)
Date: 14 September, 2020 21:55

EPC rules say that all matches must have full bench cover for the front row, EPC also have set a precedent for allowing medical jokers in exceptional circumstances.

Only having one fit loose head prop is exceptional circumstances.

But that doesn’t make headlines.

Re: Loosehead injuries
Posted by: Dave Jackson (IP Logged)
Date: 14 September, 2020 22:10

The problem surely is any potential Joker will not be Covid secure and have got through the testing and isolation protocols. Unless we used a player from another premiership team that is not involved in Europe this weekend as bench cover.

Re: Loosehead injuries
Posted by: Exeforever (IP Logged)
Date: 14 September, 2020 23:35

I'd rather that you borrowed loosehead cover from anyone except Saracens than that we went to uncontested scrums and only 14 Northampton players. We are in exceptional circumstances brought about by PRL/EPRC's insistence on completing the season rather than taking the domestic and European positions at the suspension of play in March, as we should have done IMO. I imagine that Ellis Genge and Marler (for examples) would relish a chance to have a go at Exe and as neither of their clubs are in a position of risk they should be available for a suitable fee...

Re: Loosehead injuries
Posted by: Dave Jackson (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 08:09

Quote:
Exeforever
I'd rather that you borrowed loosehead cover from anyone except Saracens than that we went to uncontested scrums and only 14 Northampton players. We are in exceptional circumstances brought about by PRL/EPRC's insistence on completing the season rather than taking the domestic and European positions at the suspension of play in March, as we should have done IMO. I imagine that Ellis Genge and Marler (for examples) would relish a chance to have a go at Exe and as neither of their clubs are in a position of risk they should be available for a suitable fee...

Sarries clearly are already still in the competition so that will not happen. Likewise Leicester are in the challenge cup so no chance of Genge. But other teams have no match and as you say surely a short term loan is better than a farce of uncontested scrums

Re: Loosehead injuries
Posted by: Flook (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 09:14


Re: Loosehead injuries
Posted by: LeicesterSaint (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 09:28

Given the scenario I can't see them sticking to the rules and not allowing us to bring someone in but as above - who? There are the COVID issues and then there are also contract/insurance issues, as much as I'd like to see Marler bring his boots at the weekend I'm sure it couldn't happen for many reasons - what if they got injured?

We will have to find someone or use a TH as you can't start the game without bench cover for front row, however (and no disrespect to Manny as I thought we did quite well) but I can see a yellow after a few scrum penalties resulting in either a TH out of position or a loanee coming on for the loss of a flanker and then potentially them also being carded so down to 14 and uncontested later in the game anyway.

Re: Loosehead injuries
Posted by: Saint Ted (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 10:09

EPC aren’t going to let it be a scenario where we only have one loose head prop in the squad. It’s the quarter finals of the showcase cup of the season and they will want a decent match.

Best option given other restrictions will be to sign one of the Newcastle loose heads on loan who will be going through the same covid protocols as the rest of the prem

Re: Loosehead injuries
Posted by: Saintsman94 (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 10:38

A loosehead from Newcastle seems the best option for me too, assuming ERPC allow it. They are, presumably, in some sort of pre-season at the moment with no games other then pre-season friendlies coming up. I would have thought a win-win for Saints and Falcons to have one of their players, Sam Lockwood perhaps, getting some game time against one of the best team's in Europe.

Would be a whirlwind week for someone to come in, undergo the necessary covid protocols, learn lineout calls and be ready for the weekend mind. Gordan Reid might be a better option as he'll already know a number of those calls but I'm not sure what he's doing since being released.

Re: Loosehead injuries
Posted by: Abington Adam (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 11:57

We're discussing this now, at around 4 days before the team is announced. Hasn't the time for a replacement to be brought in, train etc passed already?



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Re: Loosehead injuries
Posted by: Scooby Saint COYS (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 12:03

Lockwood would be great. Unfortunately I’m not sure it’s a risk-free decision for Falcons, because there’s going to be a sizeable jump in intensity between their pre-season and a European quarter final, with associated injury risks. But they might decide the benefits (prep for new season) outweigh the risks.

Re: Loosehead injuries
Posted by: LeicesterSaint (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 13:58

It does seem to be getting very late - my guess would be that we'll have to make do with a TH there. If EPCR are being difficult then there isn't time or money for a challenge. Even if they immediately said yes I think it would still have been pretty tough to get a contract done, insurance in place and leave at least some time to train with the squad.

I absolutely agree that we should fulfil every fixture with the best team available but can we really afford to throw money about on legals, contracts and insurance for a single game that, let's be honest, we'd have a very slim chance of winning even with a full roster the way we're playing at the moment.

Re: Loosehead injuries
Posted by: Saintsman94 (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 13:59

It's definitely too late for conversations to be starting now. You would hope that if we're bringing in someone else the deals already been done and he (whoever they might be) is training on the back pitches of Franklins Gardens right now!

I agree Scooby Saint, certainly not without a risk if Falcons were to lend us a player but hopefully they would decide the reward outweighs that risk. Even from a financial stand-point, us paying them for Lockwood's services for a game or two might be incentive enough at the moment.... It might also not be financially viable for us.

Logistically and financially this is a bit of a nightmare situation for us but I firmly believe bringing in an extra body is a better decision than the alternatives. Switching a tighthead across or forcing Manny, who until last season was a number 8, to play 80 minutes against Williams and/or Francis seems far more dangerous. Should we have to play with 14 men for some of the game because of this, the whole thing becomes farcical. What a weird situation!

Re: Loosehead injuries
Posted by: Saint Ted (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 14:14

You would hope conversations started last week when it was evident we were down to our last two loose heads, if they weren’t we’ve got bigger problems than what’s happening on the pitch

Re: Loosehead injuries
Posted by: Sir Hector (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 21:32

How far away from fitness is Waller? Could he bench? Assuming injuries to Danny H-W, Nick A and Frans are all significant and they are unavailable.

Re: Loosehead injuries
Posted by: twsaint (IP Logged)
Date: 15 September, 2020 21:46

I suspect our physios are working hard to try to get one of those fit for Sunday. It won't be Danny.

Re: Loosehead injuries
Posted by: Brackleysaint (IP Logged)
Date: 16 September, 2020 07:14

I have a feeling we may start with Owen Franks at loosehead, I could well be wrong and often am!

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