Exeter v Bath - We Are Not Finn-ished Yet

What do you think? You can have your say by posting below.
If you do not already have an account Click here to Register.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2024:04:24:18:16:25 by CoochieCoo.

Time as you say for us to put this unwanted record to bed - motivation will not be an issue and the great thing about Chiefs is you know pretty much how they will play:

I would expect a team similar to:

Gallgher
Joe C
Ollie L
Max O
Will M

Bailey
Spencer

Obano
Dunn
Stuart
Ewels
Jacque DP
Hill (if fit)/Bayliss
Underhill
Barbeary

Annett
Schoeman
Du Toit
Stooke/Roux
Coetzee
Bayliss/Hill/Reid
Schreuder
Grace if registered - offers that X factor or Butt.

Still feel Bayliss is a better option than Reid at present - really rate Miles but he does appear to miss key tackles at crucial times which are always glaring as a back row. Bayliss is just a phenomenon when fully fit speed of a back and power of a forward and offers extra protection if you get caught out with injuries a can easily play on wing or centres.

Grace is a bit like I F-W for them he is X factor and best of all Chiefs know next to both about him.

Stuart/Du Toit is just a call - personally I think Thomas has pulled away from Will in the power/scrummaging dept but what a luxury to have 2 World Class TH Props.

JDP will offer an even greater line out presence given Exeters dominance in that wind - conditions I fully expect will be totally different on Saturday. I know a lot of players from the previous game are really hurting after that performance and see Saturday as a real marker and a rare chance to put a few things right.

I don’t think there’s too many contentious calls for this week based on what we know at the moment.

Feels like Stuart is due a start and I’d like to see Bayliss start too. Other than that it’s just a question of the second row partnership and whether we risk a 6/2 with limited back options

Great headline, loved it

Quote:

Ali1969
Time as you say for us to put this unwanted record to bed - motivation will not be an issue and the great thing about Chiefs is you know pretty much how they will play:
I would expect a team similar to:

Gallgher
Joe C
Ollie L
Max O
Will M

Bailey
Spencer

Obano
Dunn
Stuart
Ewels
Jacque DP
Hill (if fit)/Bayliss
Underhill
Barbeary

Annett
Schoeman
Du Toit
Stooke/Roux
Coetzee
Bayliss/Hill/Reid
Schreuder
Grace if registered - offers that X factor or Butt.

Still feel Bayliss is a better option than Reid at present - really rate Miles but he does appear to miss key tackles at crucial times which are always glaring as a back row. Bayliss is just a phenomenon when fully fit speed of a back and power of a forward and offers extra protection if you get caught out with injuries a can easily play on wing or centres.

Grace is a bit like I F-W for them he is X factor and best of all Chiefs know next to both about him.

Stuart/Du Toit is just a call - personally I think Thomas has pulled away from Will in the power/scrummaging dept but what a luxury to have 2 World Class TH Props.

JDP will offer an even greater line out presence given Exeters dominance in that wind - conditions I fully expect will be totally different on Saturday. I know a lot of players from the previous game are really hurting after that performance and see Saturday as a real marker and a rare chance to put a few things right.

Cant see it being sensible to play a 6/2 now with Worboys being the only 10 cover. Also not a chance we go into the game without a backup 10 option. It will either be

22. Worboys
23. Coetzee/Barbs

Or

22. Worboys
23. Butt

Very harsh on Reid imo - missed one tackle vs Quins after an unreal season. Saying he’s missed other crucial tackles isn’t fair. Deserves the place over Bayliss - However great to have so many options who are top quality.

Harris being out is a real issue, he would be perfect for the bench in this situation.

Quote:

hasta
Harris being out is a real issue, he would be perfect for the bench in this situation.

Agree. Terribly timed injury

Personally, despite it not going well last time out, I’d still rather have Spencer covering 10. These big games need experience more than anything else IMHO. Could still go 6:3 with Schreuder, Butt and McCon on the bench, but if Landy went down, I’d move Spencer to 10.

2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper

Worboys has, at least, been regularly playing at 10 in a winning team. The biggest issue bath had when Cam went off was the team clearly had no idea where they were lining up.

Quote:

hasta
Worboys has, at least, been regularly playing at 10 in a winning team. The biggest issue bath had when Cam went off was the team clearly had no idea where they were lining up.

Which was true and made it strange that OB moved to 12, he should have been in his natural position to organise the backs.

If JvG is confident in Bailey let him run the game and tell Spencer to give him the kicking duties. You cripple the confidence in the 10 to my mind if you don't.


Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.

This is when we see how much the "Master" has passed on............

We come through this and Bath make a leap forward in so many ways.....!!!!

Quote:

shipwrecked

Quote:

hasta
Worboys has, at least, been regularly playing at 10 in a winning team. The biggest issue bath had when Cam went off was the team clearly had no idea where they were lining up.

Which was true and made it strange that OB moved to 12, he should have been in his natural position to organise the backs.

If JvG is confident in Bailey let him run the game and tell Spencer to give him the kicking duties. You cripple the confidence in the 10 to my mind if you don't.

To the earlier point, Landy wasn't kicking last season when we got 20 points out of 20. If Spencer is the better kicker, Spencer kicks.

Quote:

hasta

Quote:

shipwrecked

Quote:

hasta
Worboys has, at least, been regularly playing at 10 in a winning team. The biggest issue bath had when Cam went off was the team clearly had no idea where they were lining up.

Which was true and made it strange that OB moved to 12, he should have been in his natural position to organise the backs.

If JvG is confident in Bailey let him run the game and tell Spencer to give him the kicking duties. You cripple the confidence in the 10 to my mind if you don't.

To the earlier point, Landy wasn't kicking last season when we got 20 points out of 20. If Spencer is the better kicker, Spencer kicks.

I agree, but even to the extent of line kicking where he was 3rd choice behind Gallagher and Spencer?
Clearly now isn't the time to experiment but it's a problem of our own making.


Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.

Gallagher does line kicking when Finn is on. I don't see Finn having his confidence crippled.

Quote:

hasta
Gallagher does line kicking when Finn is on. I don't see Finn having his confidence crippled.

Finn Russell is 31, Played in 6Ns, RWC's, 55 Tests, 2 Lions tours, played in France etc. etc. His rugby ego is mature. Orlando Bailey is 22, only ever played at Bath and still learning his trade. The two are simply not comparable.

I think he needs to be trusted more, JvG tells him to play his own game yet limits his role. JvG is more often than not spot on but this one I think JvG has got wrong. you clearly are happy with the status quo.


Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.

Agree SW, let landy be the main man.

Fair enough if he doesn't do goalkicking and all the pen line kicking but get the ball in his hands lots and allow him to get the backline moving and let him share the tactical kicking game with spencer.

I am excited to see how he goes over the next month.

Mojo has done a decent job at 10 in the past but the issue is having all of finn/ redpath/ harris/ tdg out at the same time. They have all played 10 and are ball players who would help whoever is at 10.

Landy and mojo is exciting at 10/12 but we are one more backline injury away from carnage I think.

Some tricky choices. 6 day turnaround to sarries as well which is another massive match.

Gallagher
Big Joe
Lawrence
Mojo
Muir
Bailey
Spencer

Beno
Dunn
Tdt
Roux
Ewels
Reid
Underhill
Barbeary

Bench: annett, schoeman, stuart, stooke, coetzee, schreuder, worboys, rmc

Wouldn't risk hill- hopefully be fine for sarries. Maybe look to rotate 4 or 5 others into the starting xv against sarries.... Stuart, stooke, jdp, bayliss, coetzee etc. Will need to freshen up the pack.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2024:04:18:08:01:05 by Charlieboa1.

Quote:

Charlieboa1
Landy and mojo is exciting at 10/12 but we are one more backline injury away from carnage I think.

For me, the Hooper years of fielding 5 backrows with another 2 on the bench because we'd run out of locks (or vice versa, or drafting in emergency cover so that we can actually field a front row rather than forfeit matches) have redefined my view on "injury induced carnage"

We've still got Bailey, Worboys, Ojomoh, Lawrence, Butt and Wright to fill out the 10/12/13 shirts without having to play anyone at all out of position, or even dip into the academy.


It's damaging to our hopes of top 4, but it's not carnage IMO (nor is another injury or two) to those 6 players.
For me "carnage" is academy players starting AND their bench replacement being in the academy. "verging on carnage" is senior players starting out of position, with their bench replacement being in the academy.
2nd choice 10 and 2nd choice IC is... within normal range.

A man who cannot change his mind, cannot change anything

RAEBURN SHIELD



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2024:04:18:08:39:07 by Which Tyler.

Agree WT , we have had it way worse in the past.

With finn, redpath, harris, tdg out I do think if we lost one more of our midfielders then as you say seriously damages our chances of top 4 or doing anything of we get there.

A midfield of landy, butt, lawrence for example would be fine but it's not great compared to finn, cam, lawrence but agree - carnage for our chances of winning the thing but still decent players playing in their proper positions

Quote:

HK890

Quote:

Ali1969
Time as you say for us to put this unwanted record to bed - motivation will not be an issue and the great thing about Chiefs is you know pretty much how they will play:
I would expect a team similar to:

Gallgher
Joe C
Ollie L
Max O
Will M

Bailey
Spencer

Obano
Dunn
Stuart
Ewels
Jacque DP
Hill (if fit)/Bayliss
Underhill
Barbeary

Annett
Schoeman
Du Toit
Stooke/Roux
Coetzee
Bayliss/Hill/Reid
Schreuder
Grace if registered - offers that X factor or Butt.

Still feel Bayliss is a better option than Reid at present - really rate Miles but he does appear to miss key tackles at crucial times which are always glaring as a back row. Bayliss is just a phenomenon when fully fit speed of a back and power of a forward and offers extra protection if you get caught out with injuries a can easily play on wing or centres.

Grace is a bit like I F-W for them he is X factor and best of all Chiefs know next to both about him.

Stuart/Du Toit is just a call - personally I think Thomas has pulled away from Will in the power/scrummaging dept but what a luxury to have 2 World Class TH Props.

JDP will offer an even greater line out presence given Exeters dominance in that wind - conditions I fully expect will be totally different on Saturday. I know a lot of players from the previous game are really hurting after that performance and see Saturday as a real marker and a rare chance to put a few things right.

Cant see it being sensible to play a 6/2 now with Worboys being the only 10 cover. Also not a chance we go into the game without a backup 10 option. It will either be

22. Worboys
23. Coetzee/Barbs

Or

22. Worboys
23. Butt

Very harsh on Reid imo - missed one tackle vs Quins after an unreal season. Saying he’s missed other crucial tackles isn’t fair. Deserves the place over Bayliss - However great to have so many options who are top quality.

HK I am a huge fan of Miles yes he missed the tackle on AE in the Quins match - but there have been a couple of others the Vunipolo one in the Sarries match last season springs to mind which led to Vunipolo scoring a solo wonder try - it is not the fact of missing the tackle it is more about why and where the tackle was missed - more an over commitment which isn’t a criticism but more of where he is in his development- I am excited where he will end up. I just feel Josh at present is a more complete package both players are really exciting and we are lucky to have secured their long term service.

As for a back up 10 - think Lee and JvG will see Max O potentially or even Ben Spencer filling that role if required- Worboys has been away for so long it is a lot to bring him straight in - just a thought not a prediction and certainly not criticism of any player. I cannot see us turning our back on the 6/2 split after one failure as it suits our game plan and style too well IMHO.

JvG has been lauding youngsters like OB3 all season, yet never gave him the reins last time out - now let him own it and shine!

Adopted Players: All of the little blighters!!!

There's obviously going to be the possibility of a bit of improvisation around 9/10/12 . I just hope that they have a little more tactical clarity around it, should they pick up an early injury. Last match was a ridiculous mess. Spencer has to trust Orlando to call the shots - but Orlando has to assert himself too - tap into your inner Finn Russell, please, not your inner Rhys Priestland.

Also think that Ollie L is due a big game for us - Saturday would do nicely.

And, as for 6/2 splits - the 6th forward does not ever make a difference. Ever.

I seriously think that Finn as water boy can be hugely beneficial too.

Of course, his skills on field with the ball are his core strength- but the attitude he’s instilled at a club where self doubt has been the order of the day for decades can’t be under estimated. If Landy gets charged down, or somesuch, and Finn runs on at the next break and has a laugh with him about it, that’s worth its weight in gold.

I sense Landy is a confidence player and needs chivvying along a bit, so we need the guys around him to help him play as well as we know he can and not go into his shell. Spencer’s ‘Saracens’ intensity, I’d bet, can be a lot for young players (especially more introverted guys like Bailey) so Finn in and around the team, even if he’s on one groin and in a tracksuit, should help.

2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper

Adam Leal listed as officiating this weekend - without giving it a kiss of death” he has been one of only a few impressive officials this season to date.

[quote Ali1969][quote HK890][quote Ali1969]

As for a back up 10 - think Lee and JvG will see Max O potentially or even Ben Spencer filling that role if required- Worboys has been away for so long it is a lot to bring him straight in - just a thought not a prediction and certainly not criticism of any player. I cannot see us turning our back on the 6/2 split after one failure as it suits our game plan and style too well IMHO.[/quote]

I don’t think either them are actually ready to lead the line at 10 in a playoff pushing game. Spencer showed that he needs to be at 9. Worboys will have been training with bath when he’s not at Chinnor so will have been around the camp all year. Nothing against the 6/2 think it’s won us games this season but it’s not possible with Worboys who only really covers 10 (Can play 15) compared to Bailey who could cover 10/12/13/15. If they decide to go for Butt and just hope no 10 injury then fair play but that is a massive risk.

Quote:

shipwrecked

Quote:

hasta
Gallagher does line kicking when Finn is on. I don't see Finn having his confidence crippled.

Finn Russell is 31, Played in 6Ns, RWC's, 55 Tests, 2 Lions tours, played in France etc. etc. His rugby ego is mature. Orlando Bailey is 22, only ever played at Bath and still learning his trade. The two are simply not comparable.

I think he needs to be trusted more, JvG tells him to play his own game yet limits his role. JvG is more often than not spot on but this one I think JvG has got wrong. you clearly are happy with the status quo.

I definitely think Landy could have got more game time this year, I just disagree with the idea that him not line kicking from pens or goal kicking is a major problem. He wasn't doing either of those things when he was playing well late last season.

I suspect we might see more 5/3 benches because we have fewer flexible backs left in the squad.

Agree hasta - the issue is more not giving him his fair share if tactical kicking and getting the ball into hands at all.

Agree about 5:3. Bare bones in terms of utility backs

I don't consider it a 'must win' match but given the timing of the game it does present a very good opportunity because if we don't win then we will probably need to win all 3 remaining matches

Brizzle are probably the big dark horse. They've improved a lot in recent weeks and their remaining games are all against close contenders for top 4

Quote:

shipwrecked

Quote:

hasta
Gallagher does line kicking when Finn is on. I don't see Finn having his confidence crippled.

Finn Russell is 31, Played in 6Ns, RWC's, 55 Tests, 2 Lions tours, played in France etc. etc. His rugby ego is mature. Orlando Bailey is 22, only ever played at Bath and still learning his trade. The two are simply not comparable.

I think he needs to be trusted more, JvG tells him to play his own game yet limits his role. JvG is more often than not spot on but this one I think JvG has got wrong. you clearly are happy with the status quo.

The games we’ve won have been too close in the later stages to take Finn off and give Bailey a runout so JvG couldn’t give him more game time.

Gaz Lansdown has also made some interesting comments that he just wants them to entertain and not worry to much about winning. That can definitely be liberating.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:04:19:08:24:50 by OldMarovian.

Quote:

dr.bath1865
I seriously think that Finn as water boy can be hugely beneficial too.
.

Surely he needs to be resting his groin!

Quote:

A.M 180

Quote:

dr.bath1865
I seriously think that Finn as water boy can be hugely beneficial too.
.

Surely he needs to be resting his groin!

If he has injured his groin then not a chance he will be running - at this stage he will probably only be allowed to walk so no Waterboy Finn Yet

Following the Quins loss, and Exeter two weeks ago. I feel as though we’ve strayed a bit too far from our game. Need to turn it into a dogfight and out muscle them, and kick well.

We’ve got the pack to do it, no excuses not to win IMO

I guess if he's water boy tomorrow, it's a sign that his groin isn't too bad! But good point, and hadn't really factored that in, that he likely won't be up to it. If not, I kind of still hope he travels with the team, maybe sits with Blackett, and uses his rugby IQ to unpick defences from the sidelines.

Found an article in The Times (I think in the Scottish Times by Mark Palmer) with a bit more info:

The injury is understood to be similar to the adductor muscle issue the 31-year-old suffered in Scotland’s delayed Six Nations match against Wales in October 2020. On that occasion, Russell was sidelined for six weeks. No surgery is required, and having been given a week off to holiday in Marrakech with his partner and young daughter, the former Glasgow Warriors pivot is now back in training at Bath’s Farleigh House base. He is understood to have resumed strength work in the gym and hopes to be able to begin light running at the end of the week.

2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper

On that info then he could be back for the Saints game but unlikely any time before

Great opportunity for Bailey if so

Team up. Hill fit:

Bath Rugby: 15 Matt Gallagher, 14 Joe Cokanasiga, 13 Ollie Lawrence, 2 Max Ojomoh, 11 Will Muir, 10 Orlando Bailey, 9 Ben Spencer (c), 1 Beno Obano, 2 Tom Dunn, 3 Will Stuart, 4 Quinn Roux, 5 Charlie Ewels, 6 Ted Hill, 7 Sam Underhill, 8 Alfie Barbeary.

Replacements: 16 Hame Faiva, 17 Thomas du Toit, 18 Archie Griffin, 19 Jacques du Plessis, 20 Josh Bayliss, 21 Louis Schreuder, 22 Will Butt, 23 Miles Reid

PG

I don't want to put the sign on any of them, but boy are our S&C/rehab team doing some fine work this season.

No Tuima or Vincent for Chiefs - big players for them albeit Vermulen back.

Du Toit covering LHP on bench although in past he has come on for Stuart and then Beno expected to play 65+ mins and then Thomas switches over. Annett and Coetzee missing though.

Weather looking good at present and hope we can get some retribution. Come on Bath.

No Stooke.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:04:19:12:08:34 by Ali1969.

With Bayliss on the bench i can forgive the 6:2 split

And surprisingly great news to have Ted Hill starting

Optimism rising

And Chiefs:

Exeter Chiefs:

15 Josh Hodge;
14 Immanuel Feyi-Waboso; 13 Henry Slade; 12 Ollie Devoto; 11 Olly Woodburn

10 Harvey Skinner; 9 Tom Cairns


1 Scott Sio; 2 Jack Yeandle; 3 Ehren Painter

4 Lewis Pearson; 5 Dafydd Jenkins (c)

6 Ethan Roots; 7 Jacques Vermeulen;8 Greg Fisilau.


Replacements:

16 Max Norey; 17 Danny Southworth; 18 Marcus Street; 19 Jack Dunne; 20 Christ Tshiunza
21 Stu Townsend; 22 Will Haydon-Wood; 23 Zack Wimbush

PG

Wasn't that their starting 15 last week?

My confidence we could nick this is growing after seeing the Bath XV

What's more, the wind looks pretty benign!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:04:19:12:11:06 by A.M 180.

Let’s hope the weather (and our inability to
Properly adapt to it) won’t be a huge factor this time round.

(I know we said this a couple of weeks back and it came back to bite but....)

The strength of our bench compared to theirs coupled with their 6-day turnaround following a mauling by Toulouse gives me hope and could/should offset most of Finn's absence. Wouldn't mind if Ben and Landy kick it in the air quite a bit, just as long as our set piece (lineout especially) functions. Hope we've also worked out a way for the first man to tackle IFW, other than kitting Muir out with a dart gun.

Heart says Bath, head says.... too close to call!

2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper

Quote:

gaz59
Wasn't that their starting 15 last week?

3 changes with Vermuleun coming in and Tuima and Vincent not in 23.

Well you should know exactly what's coming. Be interesting to see how the game plan and possibly result differs from a fortnight ago.

Was expecting slightly more rotation from Chiefs - But I guess this is a massive game for them lose and they’re probably out the hunt if other results go as expected.

As said before think it’s a massive Risk going 6/2 with Just Butt on the bench. I actually haven’t been overly impressed by Lawrence so far so wouldn’t have be opposed to seeing 12. Butt 13. Ojomoh 22. Lawrence - But no doubt he will now have a scorcher.

Quote:

Optimist
I don't want to put the sign on any of them, but boy are our S&C/rehab team doing some fine work this season.

+1

They’ve done a great job with the squad fitness this season

We need to kick a LOT better, but come on Bath this is a really good opportunity!

Can we please not go there with the pre-determining mentality of ‘ooh, this will be nip and tuck, let’s try to nick it by the odd point’. Just go there and play - all of our best results have come from playing a bit, or even a lot.

Quote:

HK890
I actually haven’t been overly impressed by Lawrence so far so wouldn’t have be opposed to seeing 12. Butt 13. Ojomoh 22. Lawrence - But no doubt he will now have a scorcher.

Lawrence's form has dipped a bit post 6N. It happens. He's a due a big game for us and will need no motivation. I will buy Will Butt a pint any day after that try against Tigers last season but Ollie is head and shoulders above him in the pecking order. Scorcher please, Ollie!

Bath's selection is pretty much as expected, with only a few minor "eyebrow-raisers".

As others have mentioned, with only Schrueder & Butt on the bench we're vulnerable to a disrupted backline, although Butt has played 12, 13 & 14 for us so is relatively versatile. The nightmare scenario would be if Gallagher goes off, as I'm not sure any of the outside backs have much experience at 15 (fingers crossed it doesn't come to that).

Only other question would be picking Griffin as replacement tighthead and shifting Du Toit over to cover loosehead. To my untrained eye a Du Toit/Schoeman combo would give a better platform than Griffin/Du Toit, but then again it's difficult to gauge Griffin's progression given he's been restricted to mostly cameo appearances thus far. Whilst technically he's an international front rower, I don't think that's necessarily an indicator of pedigree nowadays given the state of Welsh rugby (although he's clearly highly rated by the Bath coaches). That being said one of the real surprises from the previous match was how poorly Bath's replacement front row did against Exeter's, so maybe Schoeman has paid the price and they think that Du Toit will have what it takes to turn the screw on Marcus Street in the latter stages of the match.

Exeter have perhaps rotated less than expected, so will be interesting to see whether any of their players are showing signs of fatigue (by my reckoning Sio, Yeandle, Skinner, Woodburn and Hodge are all onto their 5th starts in 5 weeks).

In the last match Exeter rightfully identified that the path to victory was to keep possession, get their back 3 players involved as much as possible and neutralize the set piece (a lot of which was dictated by the conditions). To me that style of playing requires a lot of energy/fitness and risks giving away penalties at the breakdown when bodies are tired. Last time out Exeter knew that even if they got pinged, it was unlikely that Bath would kick a decent touchfinder and/or keep possession at the lineout, so that seemed to play into their hands.

With my Bath hat on I'm hoping that the following differences will swing the game marginally into our hands:

1. Non-hurricane strength winds = tactical kicking becomes a viable tactic + higher chance of lineout completion (both of which should play into Bath's hands)

2. Bath rest week & Exeter travelling to Toulouse = higher Exeter fatigue = Exeter forced to kick away possession more = Bath's pack able to get more of an upper hand

*BONUS* 3. Bailey steps up to the plate and shows how well he can run the backline

Quote:

Optimist
Can we please not go there with the pre-determining mentality of ‘ooh, this will be nip and tuck, let’s try to nick it by the odd point’. Just go there and play - all of our best results have come from playing a bit, or even a lot.

Exactly that. I've lost count of the times against the likes of Briz, Sale and Tigers for example the line has been "well this is going to be a tough, tightly fought match, probably only a few points in it"

And hey presto it was and we ended up losing by a point or three

We've got the ability and capacity to pull them around the pitch and to attack from different points. I'm not saying we go all out on the lash from KO but the more we look to keep it tight all the way the more we play to their strengths and not ours

I'm hoping too that JvG and co will have watched how Toulouse kept IF-W very quiet

Let’s not forget the elephant in the room, Bath’s appalling away form.

Quote:

OutsideBath
Let’s not forget the elephant in the room, Bath’s appalling away form.

Just out of interest which teams have a significantly better points haul from away matches?

Whilst finn is the obvious miss I think the loss of Harris especially is really troublesome when selecting a 23.

I would be happy with him basically covering 10-15. Redpath also can cover 10/12/13/15. To lose both really hampers our options.

Interesting that we have doubled down in 6:2 split when i assume rmc and grace available.

If Gallagher gets injured I have no idea what we do that doesn't require a huge rejig.

I would have gone 5:3 tbh with rmc on bench but I get that jvg maybe senses blood in terms of the power game. One team rested for 14 days and one team on a 6 day turnaround after getting batteeed in france.

Hoping annett, schoeman, stooke, and coetzee are fit and will come in to freshen things up against sarries after a 6 day turnaround.

Bears, Saints and Tigers all have 4/7 away wins. Quins and Sarries 3/7 and Bath and the rest bar Falcons 2/7.
So you're 6th of 10 in away form but the difference in table points isn't huge. BPs however they can be got look vital.
All.rugby site.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:04:19:17:06:28 by OldMarovian.

The notable difference (i.e. why we're in 2nd not 8th) is how many bps we've got in those away losses. So yes, we've only won two, but we've got 17 points from them all.

ETA: (also we haven't played Newcastle away).



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:04:19:17:14:44 by hasta.

Bookies have Chiefs 1/1 and Bath 19/17, it's v close...

Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw

Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]

My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's

I am in Lisbon at the moment, without my son, who would know.

Does anyone know how I can watch the match?

I wouldn’t now how to read this. I’d have thought that on paper we have the edge but our away form has been disappointing & Rob Baxter can get so much out of his team especially against Bath.

Quote:

Bath Supporter Jack
I am in Lisbon at the moment, without my son, who would know.
Does anyone know how I can watch the match?

I would think you would need a VPN to be able to watch it on your phone/tablet or you could try one of the betting apps you should be able to see which games will be live

Widcombe Garçon

Quote:

hasta
The notable difference (i.e. why we're in 2nd not 8th) is how many bps we've got in those away losses. So yes, we've only won two, but we've got 17 points from them all.
ETA: (also we haven't played Newcastle away).

So, if we have two away matches left. That makes 7 played with a possible maximum of 35 points to date. We've secured 17 which is a feather under 50%

If my maths are correct that doesn't seem a bad away record

Which clubs have a better one? Anyone know?

Just read that Bath have lost on 14 of their last 15 visits to Sandy Park, their last win coming 7½ years ago...

A result for Exeter but I think sapping them like this is a good call

’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”

We thinking red or yellow

’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”

Pressure finally pays - at last!

PG

Quote:

P G Tips
Pressure finally pays - at last!
PG

Yes it’s tight but feels like we’re just playing that few percentage points better…

Then OL kicks out on full

’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”

Feyi-Wabaso is the luckiest person in Devon this evening.
Should have had at least yellow, and then deliberate knock-on at the restart.

Gah compound errors my biggest bug bear

’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”

So much Exeter off the ball dirty play

Chiefs trying to play gridiron

’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”

Big defensive moment from us

’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”

Charlie Ewels you absolute legend

Ewels could solve the 12 issue for England!


Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.

Wow. Hope JvG tells them to keep playing in exactly the same way. Really good in top 2 inches this half and aggression just staying right side of the ref

’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”

After a couple of very toy ropey lineouts, that's been a very solid half. One of those kicks in behind is gonna pay off.

Going very nicely but still very much in the balance.

We could do with calming down a bit, particularly Dunn and Roux. I think we're quite lucky we haven't had a pen overturned with their agitating, the next one will be.

DB - not sure what IF-W has done to merit a card? If there was a deliberate knock on I didn't see it.

Good half. Exeter continue to get the rub of the green

JK7 - looked to me like he knocked the kick off forward away from our pod. No effort to knock it back. Should have been a penalty.
Very lucky with the officials' interpretation of taking Will Muir out in the air. Hugely dangerous, he really was never getting that ball. Will landed on his neck / top of shoulders. Could easily have been red for I F-W with a different set of officials.

Keep playing. Equally impressive first half a fortnight ago and we all know how that ended. Hopefully Exeter haven’t got quite as much in the tank and our bench can keep the intensity up.

Big first 10 after half time. Get the first score/keep them out and we’ll be in a good spot.

Feels like knock out rugby! Super nerve wracking!

2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper

Quote:

Dorset Boy
So much Exeter off the ball dirty play

Agree, just like last time and the rub of the green, should Painter have seen yellow.?

Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh

"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS

Silly from Roux there just no need

’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”

…and it bites us

’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”

Quote:

Dorset Boy
JK7 - looked to me like he knocked the kick off forward away from our pod. No effort to knock it back. Should have been a penalty.
Very lucky with the officials' interpretation of taking Will Muir out in the air. Hugely dangerous, he really was never getting that ball. Will landed on his neck / top of shoulders. Could easily have been red for I F-W with a different set of officials.

My view - IF-W knocked it backwards and was unlucky it was given as a knock on. Commentary of the same view.

With the Muir incident, and again commentary were of this view, it was a good contest.

Quote:

hasta
After a couple of very toy ropey lineouts, that's been a very solid half. One of those kicks in behind is gonna pay off.

Yessss

Great effort chasing that Bailey kick down but four of our guys got up from the ruck looking hurt. Ouch.

BP!!!

’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”

Is it just fatigue because this is weirdly disjointed from Exeter

’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”

Quote:

Toast and Marmite
Is it just fatigue because this is weirdly disjointed from Exeter

I think so. Looks like last week's game is catching up with them, lots of errors. We need to keep at it though.

It’s not an exciting part of the game but Bath have been excellent at sucking any momentum from Exeter when they get possession from knock ins etc

’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”

After 71/2 years, finally a win at Sandy Park, and a bonus too! Well done Bath!

Quote:

Mike the Taxi
After 71/2 years, finally a win at Sandy Park, and a bonus too! Well done Bath!

+1

Nice to get the surprise win and seriously harm Exeter’s play off chances.

Proper professional and well thought through win.

’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”

The season lives!

A fine fine result. I’d imagine JVG will be pleased to see a plan come off, and I wonder what was said between him and Russell at the whistle there

Really professional performance. Sucked the life out of Exeter and took enough of our chances.
That was a big result for us.

Word for Adam Leal. He missed some stuff, made a couple of decisions I didn't agree with, but he was calm and assured, and overall really good.

Massive win. So many top class performances, especially at 9 and “that lad who I continued to doubt cos I know nothing about rugby” at 10. But 4, 5 and 6, take a bow and a long lie down. We needed to match if not better their physical edge and Roux, Ewels and Hill were absolutely everywhere and smashing every single thing.

All the squad and staff, just brilliant. Onwards.

2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper

Agreed.
He has a very good manner with players, controls the game well and took no bovine dung from either side.

PG

Dunn excellent too. Kicking strategy and execution from everyone really good. Really good and important win.

...and, after years of being yelled at to not kick the ball away, Bath hold on to the ball for the final 2 minutes, and prove that it can result in a win!

On the whole, I have been (and am) a big fan of Exeter but I am getting a little tired of the "hard-done-by" of Rob Baxter now... "We got too involved with other things", "Well done Bath for that", etc.

What about the incessant breakdown transgressions you got away with until the last 10mins (and regularly do in every game!!!). Not sure Exeter have ever entered a ruck from anywhere BUT the side!!!!

Adopted Players: All of the little blighters!!!

Bailey looked in charge today, not afraid to try things, there was an exchange with Will Muir keeping the ball in play throwing it infield which Bailey volleyed and followed up tackled Woodburn and we won the breakdown. taking Bath 10m out, then Reid squeezed over next play.

Ewels and Spencer looked in charge of the game and we played out the last 3 minutes recycling the ball. 6 Moths ago we would have box kicked it away.
Pretty sure Schreuder came on with those instructions when BS was subbed. Excellent game management from Bath.

Bath looked much fresher!


Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.

Quote:

plong
On the whole, I have been (and am) a big fan of Exeter but I am getting a little tired of the "hard-done-by" of Rob Baxter now... "We got too involved with other things", "Well done Bath for that", etc.
What about the incessant breakdown transgressions you got away with until the last 10mins (and regularly do in every game!!!). Not sure Exeter have ever entered a ruck from anywhere BUT the side!!!!

Lots obstruction and off the ball niggle too.

PG

Lots of blocking by Exeter, and niggly off the ball antics trying to wind us up. Did well to not over-react whilst trying yo bring it to the official's attention.

Silver lining of Finn’s injury could be that the other leaders get to stand up and take charge.

Fabulous......now onto the next cup final next Friday night!

Quote:

OutsideBath
Let’s not forget the elephant in the room, Bath’s appalling away form.

You were saying.....?

PG

Quote:

Bath Supporter Jack
Fabulous......now onto the next cup final next Friday night!

Huge game on Friday. May also be our semi final. Fingers crossed we are at the Rec.

J

Great effort and super result. Spencer continues to be the heartbeat of our performances, leadership and effort from Dunn and Ewells were off the charts, and our back row of Sam, Alfie and Ted are unmatched elsewhere in the Prem.

Sarries on Friday could be our ticket to a hom semi.

Chiefs fan here with objectivity.!
No question, you totally deserved the win. If anything you were better than a 12 point win.
Given Chiefs have battled through the season with a ‘new’ young team and £2.2m under salary cap. im very pleased with our development and optimistic for the future.
Never sure about Bath tho. Name in the hat for every big name available whether they fit the profile or not. But, hey ho, you’re as good as your last game and today was your day. All the best in the play offs.

Quote:

Rowancroft73
Chiefs fan here with objectivity.!
Never sure about Bath tho. Name in the hat for every big name available whether they fit the profile or not. But, hey ho, you’re as good as your last game and today was your day. All the best in the play offs.

Objective or green eyed?
Of the side that won today, many are players developed from lesser regarded clubs or home grown, (see list). Gallagher,(Munster) Ojomoh, Muir; Bailey, Obano,(Wasps academy), Dunn, Stuart, (Nottingham), Ewels, Hill, Faiva, (Benneton) Griffin, Bayliss, Schreuder (Newcastle), Butt, Reid.

Even the likes of Barbeary, Lawrence and Hill were attracted from defunct clubs by the vision of the future portrayed by Van Graan.

Our recent success is not down to signing the best/most expensive players as you allude to but by recruiting the best coaching team. Coaches don't fall into the cap regulations.

Exeter have operated a similar policy recruiting from the failing Welsh clubs, Jenkins, Feyi-Waboso Hawkins, Tshiunza.

No magic or deception, just good management and hard work.


Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.

Quote:

Rowancroft73
Chiefs fan here with objectivity.!
No question, you totally deserved the win. If anything you were better than a 12 point win.
Given Chiefs have battled through the season with a ‘new’ young team and £2.2m under salary cap. im very pleased with our development and optimistic for the future.
Never sure about Bath tho. Name in the hat for every big name available whether they fit the profile or not. But, hey ho, you’re as good as your last game and today was your day. All the best in the play offs.

Normally enjoy your posts but perhaps they are only classy in victory rather than defeat. Excuses and then a pop at us- not great. Tbf lots of people on here seem to have a real issue with exeter which I really don't get so imagine that agitated you.

I have loads of time for exeter- think you have an excellent young squad who will get better and also feed some class players into the England set up. Love how the likes of tuima and fisalau are shaping up.

Also absolutely love Rob baxter- could listen to him talk all day. He is building another team to challeng for titles . his comparison of Clermont loss with toulouse loss was interesting and probably has value.

I said the same things before and after the defeat 2 weeks ago. Good luck for rest of the season- think it would have been a different result today if we had won 2 weeks ago tbh.

Enjoyable performance- far from perfect but controlled and professional. Any win at Sandy park is a great effort.

We benefitted hugely from a week off against a team who had to play toulouse 6 days prior. As I said at the time I think the result massively helped our prem chances.

Personally enjoyed the aggression from the likes of dunn and roux- only went over the line once.

Understandably loads has been made of losing finn but ( and I know no one will agree) I would have been more gutted to lose beno or tdt. Stick finn behind our pack of 2 seasons ago and see how he would have got on. bailey did well in those adverse circumstances and playing behind our current pack will be fine for next few games, esp as he gets sharper with the game time at 10.

Thought ref was good- some decisions that could have gone our way but he used common sense and good judgement to reach decent decisions I think on balance.

Roll on sarries- 6 day turnaround and then a week off. Really tough selection to get right.

If annett, stooke and coetzee are fit I would get them in the 23- pack will need freshening up a bit. Not many options in thr backs! Huge game!

Quote:

P G Tips

Quote:

OutsideBath
Let’s not forget the elephant in the room, Bath’s appalling away form.

You were saying.....?

PG

Yep, finally an away win at Exeter puts that notion to bed.

Quote:

Rowancroft73
Chiefs fan here with objectivity.!
No question, you totally deserved the win. If anything you were better than a 12 point win.
Given Chiefs have battled through the season with a ‘new’ young team and £2.2m under salary cap. im very pleased with our development and optimistic for the future.
Never sure about Bath tho. Name in the hat for every big name available whether they fit the profile or not. But, hey ho, you’re as good as your last game and today was your day. All the best in the play offs.

(Quote from after your Last 16 win ´But perhaps most worryingly for Bath fans as I saw it was they couldn’t match the passion, desire and sheer cussedness of the home team. Why? Surely they knew what was coming?)

Touché I don’t think Exeter could match the Passion, desire and sheer cussedness of the away team

What an enjoyable evening at Sandy Park and haven’t had that privilege for any years.

Have to say well done boys - thought it was a bit rich from Baxter to suggest we were getting under Chiefs skin.

If was obvious from the start and the antics of players such as Roots they had a plan to upset Bath at every opportunity, pushing offside - hands in the rucks- coming at the side and holding players off the ball. They appeared as if they had targeted Quinn Roux for special attention.

Firstly I would like to say well done to Mr Leal and his team - thought he was excellent at not getting sucked into the Chiefs it is not us Sir - yes he missed a few but got the big decisions generally spot on.

As for us we looked a lot more structured and bar a few break outs contained Chiefs really well.

An excellent result and move on to Sarries.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:04:21:08:53:14 by Ali1969.

That game could still be going on now and Josh Hodge still wouldn’t have passed the ball to anyone.

Big talent but not so much that he can play like the best player in the under 12s and just run it past everyone whenever he gets the ball. Coaching intervention needed asap there

Quote:

Widcombe boy

Quote:

Rowancroft73
Chiefs fan here with objectivity.!
No question, you totally deserved the win. If anything you were better than a 12 point win.
Given Chiefs have battled through the season with a ‘new’ young team and £2.2m under salary cap. im very pleased with our development and optimistic for the future.
Never sure about Bath tho. Name in the hat for every big name available whether they fit the profile or not. But, hey ho, you’re as good as your last game and today was your day. All the best in the play offs.

(Quote from after your Last 16 win ´But perhaps most worryingly for Bath fans as I saw it was they couldn’t match the passion, desire and sheer cussedness of the home team. Why? Surely they knew what was coming?)

Touché I don’t think Exeter could match the Passion, desire and sheer cussedness of the away team

Chef’s kiss!

Great result, up there with the win at Sarries given our track record at Sandy Park.

I think Bailey deserves a lot of credit for his performance, and the conversation should be around what Bailey brings to the table not purely fixating on how he's going to replace/emulate Russell.

Thought his variety in attack was very clever. A few probing crossfield kicks and chips over the top in the first half made sure the Exeter defence were being kept honest and took some of the edge off their blitz defence.

He made some really important defensive interventions (including scragging Feyi-Waboso), and I do think that's probably an area where he has the edge on Russell, he's just a bit more athletic in the 10 shirt.

Also that improvisation when he volleyed the ball into Exeter's 22 was a potentially match winning moment given it ultimately led to the bonus point try. You can guarantee that if Finn had done that there'd have been a clip across every TNT social media channel titled: "Who's got the better touch: Russell or Messi?"

“I think Bailey deserves a lot of credit for his performance, and the conversation should be around what Bailey brings to the table not purely fixating on how he's going to replace/emulate Russell.”

JvG has been at pains to say that in all the conversations both he and Lee has had with Orlando is to be yourself - I was told by someone at the club that Finn has been superb in spending time with Bailey and giving him the confidence to be himself. That is what you invest in when you have a star player it is not just what they do on the pitch it is what they do around the club.

I agree I thought he was excellent yesterday and he is a different player to Finn which is what any wants two contrasting 10’s.

Quote:

theredseat
That game could still be going on now and Josh Hodge still wouldn’t have passed the ball to anyone.
Big talent but not so much that he can play like the best player in the under 12s and just run it past everyone whenever he gets the ball. Coaching intervention needed asap there

It was an odd performance from Hodge. Suspect coaches and team mates will be picking him up on it on Monday, he certainly helped our cause.

If someone from another club comes on 'ere and gives a back handed compliment then I think Bath are making real progress!!!

Hodge had an absolute shocker. IFW looks fantastic, let's hope he avoids second season syndrome.

Two huge differences from a fortnight ago, we kicked about 1000% better (particularly Spencer) and we kept pressure on them rather than taking it entirely on us and being exhausted by the end of the game. Lineout wobbled at first, but got much better.

Yes, Bailey was on it in attack and defence. I remember him levelling either Roots or Fisalau in the second half. I bet in the coming weeks a few of those chips and cross kicks are even more on the money and lead to scores. Also (one missed touch aside) impressed by his line kicking to the left. Lovely distance. Great technique. Must be huge for him to play behind a pack as on it as that. Hopefully the experience of the horror seasons makes him a very strong player.

Oh, and don’t have the stats, but our line out was much improved. Can’t underestimate how good Ewels was overall but he clearly got the lineout working. Trying to work out if his dummy and run was intentional? Don’t think it was, as think one of his lifters blocked the pass to Spencer so he just went for it but brilliant thinking. His pace, then the drawing of the defender and offload to Spencer would have been top class from a centre, so world class from a 2R!

2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper

Ewels took the opportunity of not being held at the lineout maul, spun round out of it and galloped away. Loved how he eyeballed the defender, gave him an Ali shuffle and offloaded

Class stuff which we wouldn't have seen 2/3 years ago

Quote:

gaz59
Class stuff which we wouldn't have seen 2/3 years ago

Really agree with this, 2-3 years ago we'd have found a way to butcher that opportunity. Really good from Ewels.

Win all our games, get a home semi (2 out of three is also probably a home semi). Let's start with Sarries.

Quote:

dr.bath1865

Oh, and don’t have the stats, but our line out was much improved. Can’t underestimate how good Ewels was overall but he clearly got the lineout working.

Ewels was close to MOTM, but must also mention that Dunn was right back on it both at lineout and around the park after a somewhat wobbly season. Hopefully he has come through his rough patch.

’’Paint the whole world with a rainbow”

Excellent result against an Exeter side who played really poorly on the day. Slade and Immanuel Feyi-Waboso aside I don't think that Exeter had anything to give really (aside from obstruction and off the ball stuff) and Hodge was like an U12s player at times in terms of his 'head down and not passing' approach. Wasn't a pretty game obviously but a solid arm wrestle and the Bath tactics staff has clearly identified that the Exe rush D was leaving lots of space behind for the little chips over and that paid off in the end. 5 invaluable points.

[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]

It’s always a bit disappointing when we win to hear that our opponents played poorly. I don’t share that view. I think we played up to our ability & they didn’t play above theirs, both of which is unusual.

Exeter weren't quite on it, likely fatigued and made silly individual errors (i.e. Hodge refusing to give it to the most dangerous player on the field, the clear out that ruled out Cairns' try was so dumb!), but I don't think they were any worse than we were a fortnight ago. They defended well but weren't clinical enough in attack, which was also down to our excellent defence, especially at the breakdown. The Spencer t/o in our 22 and then the Ewels break and Spencer try just on half time was a huge swing. Super tight game before and, in most respects, after that.

It's rarely the case that both sides are great and the marginally better side wins. I think it's more likely that one side gets on top, this forces mistakes from the other team, especially if they're tired, and so the chasing team has to chase it even more, which can lead to the superior team on the day dominating even more. I'd say we were the better team but our defence still needed to be right on it up until about the 78th minute. Exeter weren't terrible- we were just better on the day, which was a reversal from a fortnight ago.

2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper

Quote:

Bath Hammer
It’s always a bit disappointing when we win to hear that our opponents played poorly. I don’t share that view. I think we played up to our ability & they didn’t play above theirs, both of which is unusual.

Not necessarily BH, it could well be that Bath made them look poor (particularly in the forwards) - they didn't have the answer to that on the day, as we didn't in the wind a couple of weeks before. Doesn't take away from the bath win.

[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]

Did Chiefs play poorly or was it a case we subdued them and prevented them from playing?

I think we played really well and never looked like losing the game. Chiefs really were trying every trick in the book to disrupt our game - their off the ball business was getting so tedious- they targeted Roux because he reputed to have a short fuse - recall Roots getting up from a ruck where he had been entangled with Roux rubbing his eyes like a child as if in a playground making Roux out to be a “cry baby”.

The most pleasing part is that we remained professional and kept above it bar Roux’s clear out.

Chiefs are a committed and talented team and I personally think our game management and win was something special and would challenge any team to come to Sandy Park against a Chiefs team knowing that this was a must win game and beat them with a bonus point and stop them getting any points.

I agree, I think Chiefs game plan has relied on the physicality of the forwards for a long time (its in Baxter's DNA) if you match or as we did get on top there they struggle.

I found Baxter's comments just after half time disingenuous as it was mainly Exeter with the off the ball stuff niggle and illegal breakdown work.

I normally like what he has to say but his comments on Saturday we poor. I wonder if the message in the dressing room was the same?

Quote:

Murty7
I agree, I think Chiefs game plan has relied on the physicality of the forwards for a long time (its in Baxter's DNA) if you match or as we did get on top there they struggle.
I found Baxter's comments just after half time disingenuous as it was mainly Exeter with the off the ball stuff niggle and illegal breakdown work.

I normally like what he has to say but his comments on Saturday we poor. I wonder if the message in the dressing room was the same?

They’ve become accustomed to beating us, often with ease, and although Baxter is very decent following wins it’s a bit different when you know your team was second best & he showed it. I prefer JvG’s phlegmatic & unemotional approach which doesn’t mask the suspicion of being a sore looser.

I don’t think Exeter were particularly bad. Below par maybe but they didn’t stink the place out by any means.

They’re a young team without a huge amount of depth or experience so their margin for error week to week is always higher than other teams plus Bath came in rested which helped as well.

Quote:

theredseat
I don’t think Exeter were particularly bad. Below par maybe but they didn’t stink the place out by any means.
They’re a young team without a huge amount of depth or experience so their margin for error week to week is always higher than other teams plus Bath came in rested which helped as well.

Stolen from Ballsout on the Exe board:

- Bath team average age: 26.9
- Exeter team average age: 26.4

I think that people see Exe as being so green this season because it comes of the back of a team that were so experienced and had won it all. After all, their backs included 13 Henry Slade, 12 Ollie Devoto, 11 Olly Woodburn none of which are spring chickens and even Harvey Skinner is 26 and Bailey is 22 (Max Ojomoh is 23).

[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]

Stuart Barnes wrote a v snippy report about Bath and the game in yesterday's Sunday Times. I'll put up a few comments later today unless I can get it from behind a paywall. In essence Exeter were tired after their HC effort v Toulouse whilst we had a fortnight off. Exeter will struggle to make the playoffs whilst we won't trouble Saints of we repeat that performance. V disappointing read, put me off my toast and marmalade...

Adopted players: 24/25 J Bayliss; [24] O Lawrence; [23] J Cokanasiga; [22] M Green; [21] A Watson; [20] T Faletau; [19] M V Vuuren; [18] T Faletau; [17] D Denton; [16] H. Agulla; [15] L Houston; [14] W Spencer; [13] F. Louw

Family . Community . Nation - [sdp.org.uk]

My mind's been going places without me lately - Bushfire The B52's

I wouldn't let it worry you too much Clarkey3k. The Saints 1st team would trouble most teams in Europe this season I would say. None of Bath, Bris, Sarries or Quins would fancy a semi at their place I'm sure. Hard to disagree with Barnes on that one in my view.

[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]

Quote:

BathMatt53

Quote:

theredseat
I don’t think Exeter were particularly bad. Below par maybe but they didn’t stink the place out by any means.
They’re a young team without a huge amount of depth or experience so their margin for error week to week is always higher than other teams plus Bath came in rested which helped as well.

Stolen from Ballsout on the Exe board:

- Bath team average age: 26.9
- Exeter team average age: 26.4

I think that people see Exe as being so green this season because it comes of the back of a team that were so experienced and had won it all. After all, their backs included 13 Henry Slade, 12 Ollie Devoto, 11 Olly Woodburn none of which are spring chickens and even Harvey Skinner is 26 and Bailey is 22 (Max Ojomoh is 23).

Yes Matt, just read the Chiefs forum, Bath average, time wasting , ref on their side, lineout offences missed, Roux should have been carded, but overall most posters with reasoned and considered comments.

Adopted Player 2018/19 Ross Batty
Adopted Player 2019/20 Jack Davies
Adopted Player 2020/21 Cam Redpath
Adopted Player 2021/22 Darren Atkins
Adopted Player 2022/23 Gabriel Hamer-Webb
Adopted Player 2023/24 Tom Carr-Smith
Adopted Player 2024/25 Max Ojomoh

"AN OUNCE OF ACTION IS WORTH A TON OF THEORY"
FRIEDRICH ENGELS

Exeter will struggle to make the play-offs. Toulouse left a mark on them. As for Bath, they will have to be much better than they were to trouble the likes of Northampton. It may have been a first win at Sandy Park since 2016 but don’t confuse that with being remotely the stuff of champions.

thats from Barnes - wow on 2016!

[www.thetimes.co.uk]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:04:22:13:01:37 by Woodpecker .

I don't usually mind Barnes but that comment is very narrow. OK, Saturday was far from perfect (still, not bad to win with a BP at Sandy Park), but he's forgotten the performances this season that have put us 2nd. No, we're not champions (no one is yet) but the prospect of us being so isn't too 'remote'.

If we played Saints in the final tomorrow, and let's say Finn is fit: They'd be favourites but it doesn't take much to imagine us going toe-to-toe with them, and maybe getting a result in the last quarter, given the strength of our bench, as we've seen on numerous occasions this season versus very decent opposition.

2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper

Quote:

Murty7
I agree, I think Chiefs game plan has relied on the physicality of the forwards for a long time (its in Baxter's DNA) if you match or as we did get on top there they struggle.
I found Baxter's comments just after half time disingenuous as it was mainly Exeter with the off the ball stuff niggle and illegal breakdown work.

I normally like what he has to say but his comments on Saturday we poor. I wonder if the message in the dressing room was the same?

JvG was classy in response with "we met fire with fire"

Quote:

Clarkey3k
In essence Exeter were tired after their HC effort v Toulouse whilst we had a fortnight off. Exeter will struggle to make the playoffs whilst we won't trouble Saints if we repeat that performance.

I've not read the full article and Barnes isn't my cup of tea but not sure what there is to object to in the above? Sounds spot on.

Agree with Clarkey on the Stuart Barnes article - can't share as I don't have access but caught it in print yesterday. He seemed intent on finding nothing positive to say about Bath's performance and was defensive about Exeter's.

Really odd. Seemed like the club has wronged him in some way and he's having a sulk.

Quote:

Clarkey3k
Stuart Barnes wrote a v snippy report about Bath and the game in yesterday's Sunday Times. I'll put up a few comments later today unless I can get it from behind a paywall. In essence Exeter were tired after their HC effort v Toulouse whilst we had a fortnight off. Exeter will struggle to make the playoffs whilst we won't trouble Saints of we repeat that performance. V disappointing read, put me off my toast and marmalade...

Everyone knew the “prize” for winning the European tie would be a brutal doing away at the hands of Toulouse.

We might find out that losing in the European Cup is the best thing to happen to us this season.

We’ll see.

J

I wasn't impressed with Baxter either - he was a sore loser (usually like me after play Exeter). I thought Bath fronted up well and made it difficult for Exeter to play their reckless game Sara Cox didn't miss much of what Exeter were up to and letting the ref know. As a consequence Exeter were persuaded to stay clean apart from the non try when Painter took out Dunn. I thought Dunn was going to flatten him - well spotted by TMO.

Quote:

Iane2103
I wasn't impressed with Baxter either - he was a sore loser (usually like me after play Exeter). I thought Bath fronted up well and made it difficult for Exeter to play their reckless game Sara Cox didn't miss much of what Exeter were up to and letting the ref know. As a consequence Exeter were persuaded to stay clean apart from the non try when Painter took out Dunn. I thought Dunn was going to flatten him - well spotted by TMO.

Almost exactly same offence by Marcus Smith v Sale wasn't picked up by ref or TMO

Quote:

Woodpecker
Exeter will struggle to make the play-offs. Toulouse left a mark on them. As for Bath, they will have to be much better than they were to trouble the likes of Northampton. It may have been a first win at Sandy Park since 2016 but don’t confuse that with being remotely the stuff of champions.
thats from Barnes - wow on 2016!

[www.thetimes.co.uk]

I kind of agree it was a good not great performance but I don't think Exeter were materially worse the last time we played them - in fact our tried had a lot of similarities to the last match.

'Stiff of champions' stuff - I think I can see what he's trying to say but even champions have down weeks and have to still scrape victories. Even Sarries at the peak of their dominance had off-weeks which made you question if they really were as dominant as appeared - before they went on to prove they were... (Not to mention the raft of 2nd-4th places teams who have won the trophy despite not playing the 'stuff of champions').

I thougt our performance very like Saracens of 10 years ago.

Wore Ex down with kicking & defence & pounced on their errors for tries.

PG

Quote:

BathMatt53

Quote:

theredseat
I don’t think Exeter were particularly bad. Below par maybe but they didn’t stink the place out by any means.
They’re a young team without a huge amount of depth or experience so their margin for error week to week is always higher than other teams plus Bath came in rested which helped as well.

Stolen from Ballsout on the Exe board:

- Bath team average age: 26.9
- Exeter team average age: 26.4

I think that people see Exe as being so green this season because it comes of the back of a team that were so experienced and had won it all. After all, their backs included 13 Henry Slade, 12 Ollie Devoto, 11 Olly Woodburn none of which are spring chickens and even Harvey Skinner is 26 and Bailey is 22 (Max Ojomoh is 23).

My two points on that would be that I’d be surprised if it included the Exeter bench which seemed particularly inexperienced and that, on the whole, our players seem to have played a lot more rugby at a young age than Exeter’s

Bailey and IFW are both 22 and Bailey has played about 70 first team games compared to less than a seasons worth for IFW. Skinner is four years older and only has 20 more appearances as well. Ojomoh and Hodge also the same age and Max has plenty more experience in that time.

Quote:

P G Tips
Agreed.
He has a very good manner with players, controls the game well and took no bovine dung from either side.

PG

Just watched the full game replay after a gig myself down in Hawick. Second time I’ve seen Leal ref us this season and been v impressed with his decision processes and calm player engagement. Good ref.
Bath were equally as good managing a potentially tricky game without the Finn stardust. Bodes well. Line out much better good game management and effort 1-23 and a low stupid penalty count that could have been lower still (Roux).

Quote:

P G Tips
I thougt our performance very like Saracens of 10 years ago.
Wore Ex down with kicking & defence & pounced on their errors for tries.

PG

The Mojo try felt very Sarries to me.

Quote:

hasta

Quote:

P G Tips
I thougt our performance very like Saracens of 10 years ago.
Wore Ex down with kicking & defence & pounced on their errors for tries.

PG

The Mojo try felt very Sarries to me.

Yep, chasing kicks very very hard is the sort of 'no talent required ' stuff that sarries have been the masters of

Quote:

theredseat
My two points on that would be that I’d be surprised if it included the Exeter bench which seemed particularly inexperienced and that, on the whole, our players seem to have played a lot more rugby at a young age than Exeter’s
Bailey and IFW are both 22 and Bailey has played about 70 first team games compared to less than a seasons worth for IFW. Skinner is four years older and only has 20 more appearances as well. Ojomoh and Hodge also the same age and Max has plenty more experience in that time.

This is true TRS, but someone like Harvey Skinner has been at Exe forever, Baxter can't complain about him not having a load of experience when it has been under his watch?

Ojomoh and Hodge are the same age but actually have pretty similar experience, for example below are the Prem minutes.

Year Max O Hodge
19/20: 84 190
20/21: 172 340
21/22: 1200 758
22/23: 834 983
23/24: 707 407
total: 2997 2678

(Hodge a few less this year because of his arm injury I guess)

[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]

Quote:

BathMatt53

Quote:

theredseat
My two points on that would be that I’d be surprised if it included the Exeter bench which seemed particularly inexperienced and that, on the whole, our players seem to have played a lot more rugby at a young age than Exeter’s
Bailey and IFW are both 22 and Bailey has played about 70 first team games compared to less than a seasons worth for IFW. Skinner is four years older and only has 20 more appearances as well. Ojomoh and Hodge also the same age and Max has plenty more experience in that time.

This is true TRS, but someone like Harvey Skinner has been at Exe forever, Baxter can't complain about him not having a load of experience when it has been under his watch?

Ojomoh and Hodge are the same age but actually have pretty similar experience, for example below are the Prem minutes.

Year Max O Hodge
19/20: 84 190
20/21: 172 340
21/22: 1200 758
22/23: 834 983
23/24: 707 407
total: 2997 2678

(Hodge a few less this year because of his arm injury I guess)

Fair enough - bit mind blown by how much rugby Hodge has accumulated there to be honest. Makes his headless chicken act on Saturday even less excusable really

If some of the younger (not young) players at Ex don't have as much game time, maybe it's because they always pick a first team for the Prem Rugby Cup?

I've always been really impressed with Hodge before, there's no doubt he had an absolute stinker at the weekend, but it might just be a one off.

Quote:

hasta
If some of the younger (not young) players at Ex don't have as much game time, maybe it's because they always pick a first team for the Prem Rugby Cup?
I've always been really impressed with Hodge before, there's no doubt he had an absolute stinker at the weekend, but it might just be a one off.

Maybe Feyi Wabiso nicked his girlfriend ?

Quote:

hasta
If some of the younger (not young) players at Ex don't have as much game time, maybe it's because they always pick a first team for the Prem Rugby Cup

Or conversely, over the past two seasons, that so many of those who would normally be in their Prem Cup team are also players in their main XV/23?

Looking at the two squads I'd say Chiefs feels both younger and less experienced but that's just an impression. Certainly Baxter had bought in mainly talent that is still to really develop than is already there. Ofc some exceptions to that.
Both teams bringing through young players via Academy is a credit to them and Bath in particular (to the League) seem to have a very high level of EQPs in their natch day squads.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:04:23:10:54:28 by OldMarovian.

I think historically we've probably focused on eqp to our detriment. JvG definitely supplementing that with SA beef and we're getting a better balance.

The midfield of Bailey, Ojomoh, Lawrence obviously feels (and is) experienced, but they're 22/23/24 respectively, compared to Skinner, Devoto, Slade (26/30/31) they really, really aren't. I mean it's fine, it's just weird to hear Baxter whining about it, it's not like he didn't select and prepare this squad.

Quote:

OldMarovian
Looking at the two squads I'd say Chiefs feels both younger and less experienced but that's just an impression.

Inexperienced youngsters Sio, Yeandle, Painter, Roots, Vermeulen, Skinner, Devoto, Slade and Woodburn?

Baxter's excuses are just that, excuses.

The demeanour and behaviour of the firts five of those did not speak of "inexperienced" to me!

PG

Some good points. I guess some of it is narrative building both for external and internal consumption.

Exeter Uni at present are having a purple period and have won back to back Uni titles which Chiefs are definitely feeding off.

They also have access to a huge area from Exeter to Redruth a total hot bed of rugby.

I think people tend to think because we are fortunate to have a benefactor so generous such as Bruce that our squad is all bought. We have a strong academy and U18 squad what I think we have now is a management under JvG who understands what is required to make a sustainable squad with the correct mix of skill, youth and talent - as I mentioned earlier it is the work the superstars such as Finn do behind the scenes as well as on the pitch.

Look at the signings made this year - Ross Moloney, Van Wyk, Jacques DP and Guy Pepper - not household names at all but seen as essential cogs by JvG - one would argue our contract renewals are of bigger proportions.

I would argue the greatest assets Bath FC have is our management team of JvG, Lee Blackett, JP, Richard Blaze and Stevie Scott along with Rory Murray and his team.

Just a thought, maybe the Bath young players have made more first team appearances than their Exeter counterparts because of our appalling injury count in recent seasons.

Noticed we have Luke Pearce this week for the Sarries game what I have found interesting is Karl Dickson officiating the Quins v Saints game and Ridley officiating the Gloucester game - just don’t get it - not suggesting bias from officials but my god the refereeing body are leaving themselves open to cries of nepotism. Especially the Quins game - a game they have to win!

I've finally managed to watch the game (I was free diving with oceanic white tip sharks at the time) and have nothing to add to the comments of everyone in their satisfaction of a very good win at a bogey ground.

However, my coverage included Chris Ashton as a co-commentator and I thought he was absolutely stellar. It's first time I've heard him and I hope it won't be the last.

And I also thought Adam Leal and his team were simply excellent. The call on the Horse/Feyi-Waboso collision was spot on.

... IMHO, of course.

Now in Honolulu

Quote:

joethefanatic
I've finally managed to watch the game (I was free diving with oceanic white tip sharks at the time)

I often find that this interferes with my rugby watching, too. Frankly it's a nuisance.

Quote:

JK7

Quote:

joethefanatic
I've finally managed to watch the game (I was free diving with oceanic white tip sharks at the time)

I often find that this interferes with my rugby watching, too. Frankly it's a nuisance.

I know, but somehow I struggle on...



... IMHO, of course.

Now in Honolulu



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024:04:24:09:19:48 by joethefanatic.

I really like Chris Ashton as a pundit. He has the fun angle without the AH 'smart-a$$' approach and is up there with BOD for me.

[24/25 adoptee: Francois van Wyk]

Quote:

BathMatt53
I really like Chris Ashton as a pundit. He has the fun angle without the AH 'smart-a$$' approach and is up there with BOD for me.

He made a comment in the game about Joe C's wing play and coming into the line outside the 10 where he would be more effective. From someone who had a knack of being in the right place at the right time that's good advice.


Tyler Offiah
Opinion is based on assumptions, whereas fact is based on observation or research.

Yep, liked Ashton a lot. Super knowledgeable but puts it across in a simple way, as Matt says.

What I liked most was his positivity. He just seemed to be really enjoying the game, with quite a bit of expertise added in, and rarely went anywhere near doing 'banter'. Suppose he was the straight man to Flatman's usual schtick, which as part of a double act is fine... up to a point.

2024/25 adoptee: Guy Pepper

Yeah I've been really impressed with Ashton. Great addition from TNT.

Didn't see many of these, at the game - [scontent.fbrs4-1.fna.fbcdn.net]